totaldla
NW Oregon
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The single worst drivers I encounter over the road are truck drivers. Wasn't that way 50 years ago but it is today.
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Copperhead
Central Iowa
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gmw photos wrote:Actually it's the class eight trucks that are over represented in the crash and fatality statistics compared to the number registered vehicles.
So does that imply that class eight trucks have inadequate payload capacity.
Not on a per 1 million mile basis. Accidents on a per million mile basis is lower with commercial heavy trucks than on a per million mile basis with autos in general. FMCSA data bears that out. True, fatalities may be higher on average in relation to accident frequency, but that is simply a measure of the vehicles involved. If an auto with a family does something stupid that puts them under 80,000 lb (legal weight well within the vehicle capability) of truck and freight in an accident, they are likely to end up in the morgue. And the data also shows that 80% of those fatality accidents were the fault of the auto or pickup, not the heavy truck. It is extremely rare that the commercial heavy truck was loaded above it's rating.
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Copperhead
Central Iowa
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totaldla wrote:The single worst drivers I encounter over the road are truck drivers. Wasn't that way 50 years ago but it is today.
I will be the first to admit that professional courtesy and such are severely lacking with today's crop of commercial drivers. I bellyache about them more than I do the auto/pickup drivers simply because the heavy truck operators should know better and act accordingly. Your point is a valid one, sad to say. It reflects on all the rest of us commercial operators.
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gmw photos
midwest
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Copperhead wrote:gmw photos wrote:Actually it's the class eight trucks that are over represented in the crash and fatality statistics compared to the number registered vehicles.
So does that imply that class eight trucks have inadequate payload capacity.
Not on a per 1 million mile basis. Accidents on a per million mile basis is lower with commercial heavy trucks than on a per million mile basis with autos in general. FMCSA data bears that out. True, fatalities may be higher on average in relation to accident frequency, but that is simply a measure of the vehicles involved. If an auto with a family does something stupid that puts them under 80,000 lb (legal weight well within the vehicle capability) of truck and freight in an accident, they are likely to end up in the morgue. And the data also shows that 80% of those fatality accidents were the fault of the auto or pickup, not the heavy truck. It is extremely rare that the commercial heavy truck was loaded above it's rating.
Actually, apparently both, crashes and fatalities:
"Key in that study — which includes latest-available data up through 2013 — is that commercial vehicles are disproportionately involved in crashes on the road. Heavy trucks and buses accounted for about 4% of registered vehicles and 9% of total miles driven, but were involved in 13% of accidents and 13% of overall traffic fatalities, according to FMCSA's data for 2013."
"Trucks and buses are overrepresented in traffic crashes," said FMCSA Chief Safety Officer Jack Van Steenburg.
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Copperhead
Central Iowa
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gmw photos wrote:Copperhead wrote:gmw photos wrote:Actually it's the class eight trucks that are over represented in the crash and fatality statistics compared to the number registered vehicles.
So does that imply that class eight trucks have inadequate payload capacity.
Not on a per 1 million mile basis. Accidents on a per million mile basis is lower with commercial heavy trucks than on a per million mile basis with autos in general. FMCSA data bears that out. True, fatalities may be higher on average in relation to accident frequency, but that is simply a measure of the vehicles involved. If an auto with a family does something stupid that puts them under 80,000 lb (legal weight well within the vehicle capability) of truck and freight in an accident, they are likely to end up in the morgue. And the data also shows that 80% of those fatality accidents were the fault of the auto or pickup, not the heavy truck. It is extremely rare that the commercial heavy truck was loaded above it's rating.
Actually, apparently both, crashes and fatalities:
"Key in that study — which includes latest-available data up through 2013 — is that commercial vehicles are disproportionately involved in crashes on the road. Heavy trucks and buses accounted for about 4% of registered vehicles and 9% of total miles driven, but were involved in 13% of accidents and 13% of overall traffic fatalities, according to FMCSA's data for 2013."
"Trucks and buses are overrepresented in traffic crashes," said FMCSA Chief Safety Officer Jack Van Steenburg.
But again, 80% of those accidents with commercial trucks were the fault of the auto/pickup operator. That is also a factoid from the same FMCSA.
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totaldla
NW Oregon
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Terryallan wrote:Pay load is the weight a truck can carry AFTER you subtract it's weight from the GVWR. And there is nothing you can do aside from rebuilding the vehicle, To change that
HAHAHAHAHA! Classic ignorance.
Your definition is based on the showroom stickers - and you don't understand what went into the numbers. You don't seem to get that the numbers are based on components - and you can change components to imrpove numbers.
As I said earlier, there is an entire industry dedicated to improving towing capability. They exist as proof that it is cheaper to upgrade components on a truck you own vs buying $omething different.
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gmw photos
midwest
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So in others words for anybody here to try to extrapolate that being over payload therefore equals a higher risk of crashing and/or dying/causing the death of others.....let's just say that's a pretty large leap of logic.
In fact, if we just look at the stats involving large trucks and busses, we might ( incorrectly ) conclude that being within payload is more dangerous.
Oh dear, the games we can play with numbers.
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Copperhead
Central Iowa
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totaldla wrote:Terryallan wrote:Pay load is the weight a truck can carry AFTER you subtract it's weight from the GVWR. And there is nothing you can do aside from rebuilding the vehicle, To change that
HAHAHAHAHA! Classic ignorance.
Your definition is based on the showroom stickers - and you don't understand what went into the numbers. You don't seem to get that the numbers are based on components - and you can change components to imrpove numbers.
As I said earlier, there is an entire industry dedicated to improving towing capability. They exist as proof that it is cheaper to upgrade components on a truck you own vs buying $omething different.
Again, why would anyone want to go that route? Why not just buy the right vehicle for the job to begin with? Especially since it is a combination of components that establish the basis for what a vehicle can haul/tow.
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SoundGuy
S Ontario
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Copperhead wrote:I realize that many already have the tow vehicle and are trying to make what they want in a trailer to work with it. Like most things, not the best approach. That is why determining what one wants in a travel trailer or 5th wheel and THEN getting an appropriate tow vehicle that will COMFORTABLY tow the unit safely WITHIN the limits of the TV.
But it does boggle the mind, when one can get a substantially more capable stock 3/4 ton for almost the same price, and many times even less price, off the lot than the most spec'd up 1/2 ton, why would anyone want to get the 1/2 ton if they are going to be towing frequently, and try to make it into something that it isn't.
Earlier I offered the OP 2 realistic solutions to his dilemma - either upgrade from his current 1/2 ton truck OR downsize his trailer to another he can safely tow with his current 1/2 ton. However, my bet is the OP will take a 3rd alternative which is to ignore all the good advice offered in this thread and simply hitch up his current (too large) trailer to his current 1/2 ton and hope for the best. Unfortunate, but the reality is all too many take this exact approach. ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/rolleyes.gif "rolleyes")
Regarding 1/2 tons, I've always owned a 1/2 ton, never have owned a 3/4, and never will BUT the reason is simple - I'll never own any trailer a properly equipped 1/2 ton can't tow. The largest trailer we've ever owned averaged ~ 5500 lbs loaded & ready to camp, our current trailer ~ 4800 lbs, both within the capabilities of the three 1/2 ton trucks I've been towing with since 2006. For some of us a 1/2 ton is all we'll ever need ... the difference is I understand what it can safely tow. ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/biggrin.gif "biggrin")
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gmw photos
midwest
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Copperhead wrote:gmw photos wrote:Copperhead wrote:gmw photos wrote:Actually it's the class eight trucks that are over represented in the crash and fatality statistics compared to the number registered vehicles.
So does that imply that class eight trucks have inadequate payload capacity.
Not on a per 1 million mile basis. Accidents on a per million mile basis is lower with commercial heavy trucks than on a per million mile basis with autos in general. FMCSA data bears that out. True, fatalities may be higher on average in relation to accident frequency, but that is simply a measure of the vehicles involved. If an auto with a family does something stupid that puts them under 80,000 lb (legal weight well within the vehicle capability) of truck and freight in an accident, they are likely to end up in the morgue. And the data also shows that 80% of those fatality accidents were the fault of the auto or pickup, not the heavy truck. It is extremely rare that the commercial heavy truck was loaded above it's rating.
Actually, apparently both, crashes and fatalities:
"Key in that study — which includes latest-available data up through 2013 — is that commercial vehicles are disproportionately involved in crashes on the road. Heavy trucks and buses accounted for about 4% of registered vehicles and 9% of total miles driven, but were involved in 13% of accidents and 13% of overall traffic fatalities, according to FMCSA's data for 2013."
"Trucks and buses are overrepresented in traffic crashes," said FMCSA Chief Safety Officer Jack Van Steenburg.
But again, 80% of those accidents with commercial trucks were the fault of the auto/pickup operator. That is also a factoid from the same FMCSA.
So is that to imply that 80% of the crashes involving F150's towing over payload were caused by other drivers. Let's consider that factoid. How about F250's ? F350's ? Anybody ? Hello ? Bueller ? Bueller ?
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