Cloud Dancer wrote:
If the "show" at Chicagoland Speedway is considered "a little better" I have to wonder what would be considered a lot better? As a former owner of a racetrack, and a former race promoter, my opinion is that it was an example of the very best that is possible for NASCAR to produce! This should make it obvious that the main problem is that if the layout and configuration of the racetrack is not right, NASCAR racing "shows" will be boring,....period. And, it means that since NASCAR is NOT going to discard all those tracks that are WRONG,.....NASCAR is doomed. For me, the only question is will I die before NASCAR?
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If the "show" at Chicagoland Speedway is considered "a little better" I have to wonder what would be considered a lot better? As a former owner of a racetrack, and a former race promoter, my opinion is that it was an example of the very best that is possible for NASCAR to produce! This should make it obvious that the main problem is that if the layout and configuration of the racetrack is not right, NASCAR racing "shows" will be boring,....period. And, it means that since NASCAR is NOT going to discard all those tracks that are WRONG,.....NASCAR is doomed. For me, the only question is will I die before NASCAR?
GO KYLE BUSCH!
Can you explain what you mean by best "layout and configuration" for a NASCAR track, and why that configuration makes a better race for fans. I can kinda imagine it, but am not a track designer, and don't watch NASCAR because of exactly that - not a fun race to watch for a whole buncha reasons, in part because it's become a series of catch up mini-races.
We like the old style dirt tracks and 'real" stock cars, ones you can recognize as Ford, Chevy, etc...
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Cloud Dancer wrote:
Yes, I can explain it. But, a proper explanation would be too long, because it's technical and complicated. A few pointers: in order to enhance the chances of producing a good racing show the ratio of length of the straight to the radius of the turns has to be optimized. Also, the degree of banking has to be complimentary. However, all of it will vary depending on the expected performance of the class of racecars that will be competing. AND THAT'S the problem: NOBODY can predict how much the performance of the racecars will be allowed to increase every year.
In a way, it's a sport that is designed for self destruction.
Yes, I can explain it. But, a proper explanation would be too long, because it's technical and complicated. A few pointers: in order to enhance the chances of producing a good racing show the ratio of length of the straight to the radius of the turns has to be optimized. Also, the degree of banking has to be complimentary. However, all of it will vary depending on the expected performance of the class of racecars that will be competing. AND THAT'S the problem: NOBODY can predict how much the performance of the racecars will be allowed to increase every year.
In a way, it's a sport that is designed for self destruction.
Thanks - that makes sense -- I kinda assumed the banking design has a lot to do with how the cars perform, or not. Seems to me, as a dirt biker not a car racer, that one can over-design cars for weight and speed, thus undermine what racing is all about. Should be skill of the drivers not so much the optimum "flight design" of race cars.
What little I've watched - more highlights than racing lately - that these "vehicle bodies" nearly explode on contact and peel apart, probably due to lightweight designs, and add to the issue of 'stop-slow flags'. NASCAR might do well to force a solid design that holds up under a 'ding' and let the best driver win. HA, fat chance !!
KL mostly saved it without finishing 30th. They are the 2 best drivers on the track every week. For Larson to do with a Chevy what no one else can this season is a testament to his skill.
A short aside about the race. I went to visit a buddy in Fredericksburg VA Sunday. We went to a bar to watch the race. We had trouble getting a TV over in the corner changed to the race BECAUSE THE CROWD WAS WATCHING THE WORLD CUP ON ALL 20 tvs. This country is going to heck. I guess it beats the race last year where Fox chose a dog show over the race.
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monkey44 wrote:
What little I've watched - more highlights than racing lately - that these "vehicle bodies" nearly explode on contact and peel apart, probably due to lightweight designs, and add to the issue of 'stop-slow flags'. NASCAR might do well to force a solid design that holds up under a 'ding' and let the best driver win. HA, fat chance !!
What little I've watched - more highlights than racing lately - that these "vehicle bodies" nearly explode on contact and peel apart, probably due to lightweight designs, and add to the issue of 'stop-slow flags'. NASCAR might do well to force a solid design that holds up under a 'ding' and let the best driver win. HA, fat chance !!
The cars are designed to come apart and absorb more of the impact rather than pass it on to the driver. That's one big reason why you see far fewer deaths in auto racing accidents now than in the "good old days."
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mhampton wrote:
The cars are designed to come apart and absorb more of the impact rather than pass it on to the driver. That's one big reason why you see far fewer deaths in auto racing accidents now than in the "good old days."
monkey44 wrote:
What little I've watched - more highlights than racing lately - that these "vehicle bodies" nearly explode on contact and peel apart, probably due to lightweight designs, and add to the issue of 'stop-slow flags'. NASCAR might do well to force a solid design that holds up under a 'ding' and let the best driver win. HA, fat chance !!
What little I've watched - more highlights than racing lately - that these "vehicle bodies" nearly explode on contact and peel apart, probably due to lightweight designs, and add to the issue of 'stop-slow flags'. NASCAR might do well to force a solid design that holds up under a 'ding' and let the best driver win. HA, fat chance !!
The cars are designed to come apart and absorb more of the impact rather than pass it on to the driver. That's one big reason why you see far fewer deaths in auto racing accidents now than in the "good old days."
I don't have a good answer for that - but notice one of the major "complaints" about the races is too many flags and it becomes a circle posse instead of racing start to finish. I expect that's got a lot to do with auto design for speed and collapse for safety - which brings us to the comment you make about safety factors.
Of course, we all want safe drivers ... but when racing becomes less than racing, in this case, race for XXX miles and "safety circle" for XXX miles, then it's no wonder the fans quit attending. Like I said, I have no good answer and am not a NASCAR person (dirt bikes and stock cars
![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/smile.gif "smile")
), but when you fail to entertain in any sport for an extended period during an event, than the fan base rebels ... and the sport loses audience.One thing that does happen, folks just hop on an electronic visual and watch the highlights - and if one three hour plus NASCAR race can shrink into XXX number of exciting minutes on a visual device, that says something about the "race" definition, maybe??
One way to slow the cars is to limit the design. The easiest would be to change the cars from a small V-8 to a V-6 or in-line 4 cylinder engine. Past experience with V-6 engines showed the speeds don’t really decrease. Changing engines would be incredibly expensive. Big dollar teams will put millions into engine design efforts. Small teams will have to leave the sport. I’ll leave comments about changing the aerodynamics to others.
The best option in my mind is to redesign/ rebuild the race tracks. Knock the banking down so that the drivers have to lift off the throttle and use the brake to get through the turns. And no way NASCAR is going to spend a couple billion dollars rebuilding all the tracks they own.
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