Wadcutter
IL
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Joined: 05/25/2004
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EPenney wrote:If I understand all the above correctly:
Exceeding GVRW by, lets say, 30# is not a violation.
Exceeding GAWR by 30# is a violation.
Exceeding GCVWR by 30# is a violation.
Or does the above depend on the state the vehicle is registered in.
Nope. It depends on what your registered weight is. You can register you vehicle for whatever weight you want to haul. However, if your truck's empty weight is 7500 lbs then of course it wouldn't do you any good to register it for 6000 lbs as empty you'd already be 1500 lbs over your registered weight. If you registered that same truck for 8000 lbs then you could carry an additional 500 lbs on the registered plates. If you want to haul more than the 500 lbs then you need to pay more tax, ie registration, to haul whatever load you want to haul.
Camped in every state
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captain037
Montgomery, AL
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Wadcutter, as a 25 year LEO myself, I couldn't have said it any better. Same as in Alabama basically. I too take offence to the assumption that all LEO's are ignorant of the laws that we are tasked with enforcing. While some specialize in different areas and some in others we all are educated in the basics and histories of laws and their evolvement. I personally have a masters in Criminal Justice and also have been called upon as an expert witness many times for my knowledge of firearms.
If we did not know about the laws we are tasked with enforcing, we would make unlawful arrests that would result in law suits filed on our respective departments that would destroy the governments economy.
Let me reiterate one thing that the tone of your post said. FOR THE MOST PART, STREET COPS DON"T CARE HOW MUCH YOUR RIG WEIGHS! They have criminal laws to enforce. That's what THEY do. The Alabama Public Service Commission Enforcement Division and The Alabama State Troopers weigh commercial vehicles in this state. I have never seen an RV being weighed in Alabama by any LE agency. As you said, they do not come close the the federal regulations so why would they bother? That is not to say that a bored officer in a po-dunk town at 3:00 AM might not stop you and quiz you.
I too would like to know what the poster above did for a living or....maybe he just stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night. Don't we call them "Jail House Lawyers?"
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Hannibal
Tampa Bay Area
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surveyorjp wrote:
Completely off topic, did you change your name? That rig in your sig looks awfully familiar. ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/awink.gif "awink")
.
Yes. Doc said I needed more exercise and I needed to cut out the fat. The younger ones are leaner and run faster!![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/biggrin.gif "biggrin")
I'm 900~ lbs overweight...GCWR
2020 F250 STX CC SB 7.3L 10spd 3.55 4x4
2010 F250 XLT CC SB 5.4L 5spdTS 3.73
ex '95 Cummins,'98 12v Cummins,'01.5 Cummins,'03 Cummins; '05 Hemi
2017 Jayco 28RLS TT 32.5'
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Wadcutter
IL
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[quote=captain037]
Let me reiterate one thing that the tone of your post said. FOR THE MOST PART, STREET COPS DON"T CARE HOW MUCH YOUR RIG WEIGHS! They have criminal laws to enforce. That's what THEY do. The Alabama Public Service Commission Enforcement Division and The Alabama State Troopers weigh commercial vehicles in this state. I have never seen an RV being weighed in Alabama by any LE agency.quote]
In all the counties of IL where I've worked I've only seen a couple of city and county LEOs stop trucks for overweights. In those cases it wasn't like it was a close call. They had stopped some real heavy ones and knew they wouldn't be close to legal. Even then they called one of my Troops to walk them thru the process. Most of the time the big city LEOs were too busy chasing from one call to another and the county LEOs were kept busy serving papers. The only other time I saw local LEOs jumping on trucks big time was when one of the Troops would snag one hauling a large quantity of dope or money then they all started looking at trucks coming thru. It was a great time for everyone then.
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EPenney
Galt, Ca
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Wadcutter wrote:Nope. It depends on what your registered weight is.
My registration says UNLADEN/G/CGW is 06633. If that means I'm not supposed to exceed 6633#, I need to get it raised since with 5er hitched, the TV weighs in at 9070#.
I'll call DMV tomorrow for a clarification.
'07 Chevy 2500HD Silverado "Classic" CC D/A 4x4
'07 Komfort Trailblazer T252FS fifth wheel
Reese Signature 18K Slider and other stuff.....some useful.....some not
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W7SFO
Spanaway WA
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blt2ski wrote:Needs Sleep,
If you have looked at the wts and measures vans that are used to enforce weights, they are IIRC WSP DOT wts and measures officers or some such verbage. Most commercial drivers I know refer to theses officers as DOT officers. It may be incorrect, but..........that is how they are known!
Marty
Actually their are varying classifications when it comes to weight enforcement in Washington.
You have WSP with its CVEO (Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Officers)
And you have city and county law enforcement with their own "weigh cops".
As for the WSP you see 3 different officers that I know of. Troopers, CVEO Black uniforms and CVEO Grey uniforms. The best I can tell (if I am wrong someone in the know will correct me ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/wink.gif "wink") ) that the Black uniform CVEO do roving patrols and man scales, however the grey uniform CVEO report for duty at and man the scales only.
If lam going to get stopped along the road I would much rather it be a Trooper as opposed to the CVEO's. The Troopers are always professional and don't seem to want to make an example of you. (Unless your an idiot and need some major learning). The CVEO's seem to be warm and cold when it comes to being professional, and their attitude varies like the weather.
Ryan,
Spanaway WA.
2001 Sunnybrook
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Enjoying camping every chance I get.
Enjoy meeting other folks in the area to camp with.
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blt2ski
Kirkland, Wa
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Ryan,
Despite going to some class's put on by one of these LEO's you have given me at least, more info on the two differences than I knew of. I am usually pulled over by the black uniform ones, as I am hardly ever in Everett, I90 near Nbend or south of 18 in Fed way to worry about going thru the scales. I usually get pulled over in Redmond or Issaquah near the gravel pits and quarry's where the Roving guys are.
To others, I can probably get this stickied. Will contact higher ups, and may change title to some thing more topic fitting other than "calling all LEO'S"
Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer
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JIMNLIN
Oklahoma
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Joined: 09/14/2003
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[quote=Wadcutter] [snip]
[quote=JIMNLIN]
your rated weight [GCVWR] which is your data plate lists as your ratings, what your axles are rated for, what your tires/wheels are rated for...and dot loves to look at all of this
your "tagged" weight which is what you have declared your ratings to be for tagging.[/quote]
Don't confuse registered weight with axle and gross weights. 2 competely separate things and one is not related to the other. The only thing in common between the 2 is the word "weight" but neither law is related to the other. It's confusing for those not familar with the law. When they hear/read the word "weight" they don't understand the difference between registered weight limits and axle/gross weight limits. The OP was inquirying about axle/gross limits.
I've explained registered weights ad nauseum in the past too. Registered weight limits are really nothing more than a tax. In fact if you look at your state statute for registration fees it's likely that particular statute is titled something like "registration tax fees". You pay a certain amount of tax, ie registration fee, to haul a certain amount of weight. For example, if you want to haul 8000 lbs in your pickup then you pay the tax (registration fee) for 8000 lbs. But if you then haul 11,000 lbs in your pickup you would be subject to fine for overweight on registration, ie, didn't pay enough tax to haul 11,000. We use to do force registration in IL where if someone as described in the example was stopped then we could force the driver to purchase higher registration plates right there before he was allowed to move further. The increased registration cost was in addition to the fine. Now we just write the citation and if there's a record of additional such violations, particularly if company owned, then inspections can be done on the company and force increased registration.
[/quote]
if you read the post on the web I mentioned I left off the s [typo- the web I produced explaines it better] from plates meaning plates from the truck and trailer which gives us our combined max we haul at. Registered weight is tied to the trucks plate only if the truck has a uprate GVWR from the state its registered in. That combined weight is limited to legal allowable weight on the different axles ratings on the truck/trailer combined. DOT checks each of my axle max rates per the trucks plates and they also checked my trailers GVWR or the axle itself, which ever is lower.
My state has a uprate 15000 max GVWR for vehicles 3/4 ton and up. We also may add a indorsment for a higher GVWR for non commercial use [its free]. Uprating our trucks registered GVWR has more to do with a larger combined weight [truck and trailer] than just how much we can haul in the bed but we still are limited to vehicle axle capacities per both vehicle plates. None of the 12 different state I've towed with commercial plates in used "axle manufactors ratings" which is the big buzz that started this topic again.
Talked with a shift captian from "L" troop OHP on non commercial weights under 26000 lb. His comments on enforement of non commercial vehicles was RVs are at the bottom. They only stop them if they look grossly overloaded. His comment on what vehicle weights they use for enforcement for our non commercial trucks was in his words mirrowed the same weight regs as dot uses.
To all the interested parties; we have some very good webs that experienced commercial, and non commercial, hauler hang out on and much can be learned from those folks that use these trucks 24/7 to make a living using the same trucks we tow RVs with. See [url=towrigs.com]towrigs.com[/url] or [url=uship.com]uship.com[/url] or [url=hotshothauling.com]hotshothauling.com[/url] and check out the forums.
JIM
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"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers
'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
'97 Park Avanue 28' 5er 11200 two slides
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Wadcutter
IL
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[quote=JIMNLIN] if you read the post on the web I mentioned I left off the s [typo- the web I produced explaines it better] from plates meaning plates from the truck and trailer which gives us our combined max we haul at. [/quote]
IL is the same. Total registered weight is the TV registered weight plus the trailer registered weight. That is the tax one pays to haul "X" number of pounds.
[quote=JIMNLIN]
None of the 12 different state I've towed with commercial plates in used "axle manufactors ratings" which is the big buzz that started this topic again. [/quote]
That's because the manufacturer's ratings aren't law. Those are like the mattress tags. They just tell the specs for the product, they aren't statutes.
[quote=JIMNLIN]
His comment on what vehicle weights they use for enforcement for our non commercial trucks was in his words mirrowed the same weight regs as dot uses. [/quote]
Exactly. Axle and gross weights are the same whether the truck is commercial or private. Weight laws are in place to protect the roadways. An 80,000 lb commercial load weighs exactly the same as an 80,000 private load. The statutes do not specify commercial or non-commercial, the only concern is the weight on the road.
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BertP
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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Joined: 11/07/2003
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The problem is that the weight restrictions mandated by the feds are pretty much irrelavent to most of us. If I tried to put anywhere near 20K lb on either axle of my truck, it would be grossly overloaded - assuming of course that it didn't disintegrate in the mean time. I tried to find weight laws a while ago and the only place I found anything specific was in BC which stated that you were not permitted to exceed the GAWR or GVW of any vehicle, but that law was recinded as of Jan 1, 2007 as far as I can tell. It appears to me (and I can be wrong on this) that in the past, jurisdicaitons used the manufacturer's specs in their laws but that most (all?) have now stopped doing that. I was informed by our local LEOs here in Alberta that I will be fined if my truck is "unsafe". Unfortunately, I have not been able to determine what "unsafe" means from a weight perspective. I suspect that it is one of those subjective terms like "road conditions" where it is up to the LEO to decide if doing 40 in a 60 zone is speeding or not. Technically, it can be but I don't know what the officer would use as a criteria to decide.
Bert
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