sanga
australia
New Member
Joined: 09/02/2004
View Profile
|
Hi Ron,
At last I met someone who know something about weight distribution.
I am from Australia and presently towing a Jayco 21'6" caravan total weight 4850 lb with a ball weight of 500 lb. The TV is a Toyota Landcruiser Troop Carrier GVM 7700 lb. The TV is fitted with a substantial steel bull-bar, winch, auxillary battery all of these in front of the front axle. These weighs the front of the vehicle down quite heavily, such that the front is 2" lower than the rear (when not towing). The TV is fitted with 2 fuel tank each (90 litres each or 180 lb of diesel each) and a water tank (130 lb). One fuel tank is midpoint between the front and rear axle and the second fuel tank and water tank is behind the rear axle. When not towing, I'll fill the water tank and second fuel tank, this helps to weigh down the rear of the TV and empty them when towing. When the TT attached, the TV and TT are now level. It seems there is no weight need to be distributed. Do I still need a WD and what advantage or disadvantage in adding a WD ?
I've been towing without a WD for over 10,00 miles and find the setup very stable with minimum sway (even passing road-train at high speed).
My only problem is pitching when towing on undulating road. Do you think a WD will fix this ?
Regards
Sanga
|
thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
Senior Member
Joined: 08/29/2003
View Profile
 Offline
|
Hi Tim,
You also said this before: " For me, the last sentence seems to be more of a comment than a feature of the WD system, so I might preface that with the notation, "Note: ". But if you want to leave it as is, I'm okay with that as well."
Now you can look at it this way too - I have now transformed the last "comment" sentence into further explaining another "feature" of the WD system.
Thomas and Laura Malenich
1988 Suburban 1500, 4WD
Scotty 16 1/2' , smaller and loving it
2 kids and 3 dogs
|
tluxon
Kirkland, WA
Senior Member
Joined: 08/12/2001
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:thomas malenich wrote:
Tim, I understand the difference between weight and force, however the receiver does not. It just realizes 300#s are gone after the WD is engaged.
It is important to know that it is the WD system that accomplishes that. I would dare say it is equally important as axle load shift in that it allows the hitch weight not to be exceeded.
Thanks for the chuckle as I'm sitting here imagining what the hitch receiver might be saying to itself ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/smile.gif "smile") . Seriously, the more important thing to remember is that even though the receiver won't have to react to as much vertical downward force when a WD system is applied, it will still be required to react to a substantial increase in other forces, specifically torsional. Be careful about thinking that all of a sudden you have a larger cushion of hitch capacity when applying a WD system.
Quote:thomas malenich wrote:
Just because you use a term like "hitch weight" in a definition does not mean you have to define hitch weight. I said I want to keep it simple but how can you leave out something important that the WD system does? Besides have we not already agreed to use the term "tongue weight" in the definition? We did not define tongue weight did we? Please think about that.
"Tongue weight" is a very common term used by manufacturers to represent the difference between a trailer's total weight and the trailer's axle weight. "Hitch weight" could easily be mistaken to be an interchangeable term for "Tongue weight" (even though we've made the distinction in this thread), so I believe it would require further clarification.
Does that make sense?
Tim -
wife Beverly & 2 boys who love camping
2002 K2500 Suburban 8.1L 4.10 Prodigy
2005 Sunnybrook 30FKS HP Dual Cam
Replaced 2000 Sunnybrook 26FK on 8/6/04
|
ohmy
Vacaville, Ca
New Member
Joined: 09/01/2004
View Profile
|
thank you so very much - you have a great web site
Paula
New to the non tent camping world ">
|
tluxon
Kirkland, WA
Senior Member
Joined: 08/12/2001
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:sanga wrote:
Hi Ron,
At last I met someone who know something about weight distribution.
I am from Australia and presently towing a Jayco 21'6" caravan total weight 4850 lb with a ball weight of 500 lb. The TV is a Toyota Landcruiser Troop Carrier GVM 7700 lb. The TV is fitted with a substantial steel bull-bar, winch, auxillary battery all of these in front of the front axle. These weighs the front of the vehicle down quite heavily, such that the front is 2" lower than the rear (when not towing). The TV is fitted with 2 fuel tank each (90 litres each or 180 lb of diesel each) and a water tank (130 lb). One fuel tank is midpoint between the front and rear axle and the second fuel tank and water tank is behind the rear axle. When not towing, I'll fill the water tank and second fuel tank, this helps to weigh down the rear of the TV and empty them when towing. When the TT attached, the TV and TT are now level. It seems there is no weight need to be distributed. Do I still need a WD and what advantage or disadvantage in adding a WD ?
I've been towing without a WD for over 10,00 miles and find the setup very stable with minimum sway (even passing road-train at high speed).
My only problem is pitching when towing on undulating road. Do you think a WD will fix this ?
Regards
Sanga
Sanga, your situation is unique enough that your post would serve well as a new thread. Otherwise any comments to your intriguing setup could easily be lost.
With a fuel tank and a water tank behind the axle, there are a wide range of possible loadings on your rear axle and unloadings on your front axle. A WD system will give you control over that.
Also, it is very common to experience pitching on undulating road and a properly adjusted WD system will do a great job of minimizing it.
It would be helpful to know what your rear axle is rated for and how much it scales at when hooked up without a WD system in place. You also need to pay close attention to your tires the pressure in them.
|
|
|
thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
Senior Member
Joined: 08/29/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Thanks for the chuckle as I'm sitting here imagining what the hitch receiver might be saying to itself . Seriously, the more important thing to remember is that even though the receiver won't have to react to as much vertical downward force when a WD system is applied, it will still be required to react to a substantial increase in other forces, specifically torsional. Be careful about thinking that all of a sudden you have a larger cushion of hitch capacity when applying a WD system.
_____________________________________________________________________
The fact that the receiver needs to be able to react to other substational forces is of no concern in definining a WD system. The manufacturers have taken this into consideration and built the receiver to withstand those other forces.
I am talking about something that the WD system DOES that allows the receiver to handle the load capacity stamped on it.
Barney said this:
"Doug,
As I and many others tried to explain in your other topic, YES, you should be using WD with that trailer with that truck. Even at empty weight, your tongue weight will probably be over the rating of your hitch if you do no use the WD capability."
He was making a point as to that particular importance of a WD hitch. I don't think we should leave out an explanation of this feature/function just because you think someone might not know what another word or term in you description means.
|
thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
Senior Member
Joined: 08/29/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
This is interesting. Here is a definition for a WD System that I found on RVHotlineCanada.com:
WEIGHT DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM
A hitch system built around a receiver hitch, which includes supplemental equipment such as spring bar that work to distribute trailer tongue loads to the trailer axle(s) and the tow vehicle front axle. Use of weight distribution system enhances handling and braking and increases trailer towing capacity beyond what is recommended when a weight carrying hitch is used.
Although none of us like the use of "distribute trailer tongue loads", it does in fact end with something along the lines that I suggest.
So far every description that I have found states that a WD system distributes tongue weight or loads.
* This post was
edited 09/02/04 02:32pm by thomas malenich *
|
tluxon
Kirkland, WA
Senior Member
Joined: 08/12/2001
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:tomas malenich wrote:
So far every description that I have found states that a WD system distributes tongue weight or loads.
Actually, I LIKE the word "distributes", because that is essentially what it is doing in the most simplistic terms. Why overcomplicate it with all the details of HOW it does it? As has been made obvious in this thread, it takes more than a couple sentences to explain/describe the HOW.
|
thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
Senior Member
Joined: 08/29/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Quote:Quote:tomas malenich wrote:
So far every description that I have found states that a WD system distributes tongue weight or loads.
Actually, I LIKE the word "distributes", because that is essentially what it is doing in the most simplistic terms. Why overcomplicate it with all the details of HOW it does it? As has been made obvious in this thread, it takes more than a couple sentences to explain/describe the HOW.
Tim,
My point was that most descriptions that I found state that the WD system "distributes tongue weight".
Now we all know that is not true. We all like "removing some of the load from the tow vehicle's rear axle and distributing it to the tow vehicles front axle and the trailer's axle(s)"
Did you forget that none of us liked "distributes tongue weight" as this can easily be misinterpreted???
From Ron: " A reader easily could interpret this as meaning that a WD hitch decreases tongue weight. The same reader could believe that decreasing tongue weight can contribute to sway and, therefore, choose not to use a WD hitch.
Secondly, if I knew nothing about how a WD hitch operates, the statement would lead me to believe that weight is removed from the tongue and added BOTH to the front axle AND to the rear axle. We know this is not the case."
Tim, I do not wish to overcomplicate the definition by stating HOW the WD system works. I lengthened the last sentence to include the second important FUNCTION or FEATURE of the WD system. I am not sure why you cannot see this.
|
thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
Senior Member
Joined: 08/29/2003
View Profile
Offline
|
Barney,
You must be thinking - Oh No here we go again!!
Sorry, but I feel that the WD system is responsible for two equally important things and that they both should be represented by the description. Perhaps my wording is not acceptable to all, however I think my point is valid.
|
|
|
