thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
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Here is another way we could state it even more simply:
A weight distribution system enables a tow vehicle to more effectively handle the tongue weight of a trailer by removing some of the load from the tow vehicle's rear axle and distributing it to the tow vehicle's front axle and the trailer's axle(s). A weight distribution system also increases the capacity of the receiver. Note: When the WD system is engaged the actual tongue weight does not change.
* This post was
edited 09/02/04 07:23pm by thomas malenich *
Thomas and Laura Malenich
1988 Suburban 1500, 4WD
Scotty 16 1/2' , smaller and loving it
2 kids and 3 dogs
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Batmovan
Virginia
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This has been a long and fruitful string. The amount of knowledge I have gained is amazing. But when it comes to definitions I wonder if we should defer not to ourselves but to those who design and create these systems. I suggest we contact a number of manufacturers and see how THIER engineers describe it. Especially if it is going to be locked down in a forum for the world to see.
It would be my pleasure to start sending emails and try to direct these companies to assist us in a true definition. Unless of course this is what Ron does with his engineering degree.
PS: when Ron comes back I am going to create post asking how dual cam anti-sway works.
Ford E350
7.3L Diesel: Six Gun, Transcommand, K&N, Apillar guages, Prodigy
GVWR: 8,700, GCWR: 16,000
Jayco 31Bhs, Reese Dual Cam HP
Wife and six children (1 set of triplets)
Dubbed the "BATMOVAN" by my 8 year old
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tluxon
Kirkland, WA
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Quote:thomas malenich wrote:
...
Now we all know that is not true. We all like "removing some of the load from the tow vehicle's rear axle and distributing it to the tow vehicles front axle and the trailer's axle(s)"
Did you forget that none of us liked "distributes tongue weight"...
I don't think "we all" and "none of us" applies here because I don't agree with those statements. The definition I proposed was more detailed, but in no way meant that I didn't like or agree with "distributes tongue weight".
I believe it's the exception rather than the rule that someone would interpret "distributes tongue weight" to mean "removes tongue weight".
Look - I just don't see what's wrong with using the phrase "distributes tongue weight". What other weight IS there that needs to be held off the ground when you hook up a trailer? (Unless the cargo is shifting around) No, any other "weights" - as you might call them - coming into play are forces generated by the WD system. That's all there is.
Despite what you or anyone else says, I believe "distributes" is the best word to use without getting into the HOW. Since all the manufacturer's succinct descriptions use that word, they must agree with me. I favor going with Batmovan on this one.
The only reason I can see for coming up with the more lengthy description is for those who conclude that "distributes" means "removes". If you need that, I won't stand in your way, but I'd like the record to show that I prefer the description the manufacturers use.
Tim -
wife Beverly & 2 boys who love camping
2002 K2500 Suburban 8.1L 4.10 Prodigy
2005 Sunnybrook 30FKS HP Dual Cam
Replaced 2000 Sunnybrook 26FK on 8/6/04
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tluxon
Kirkland, WA
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Quote:Batmovan wrote:
PS: when Ron comes back I am going to create post asking how dual cam anti-sway works.
What questions do you have about the Dual Cam? I've used both the Standard Dual Cam and the HP Dual Cam, so perhaps I can help.
If you haven't already done so, a good place to start is http://www.reeseprod.com/products/products/pdflinked/wd_dualcam.shtml (for some reason this page doesn't come up all the way, but it's Reese's description)
and
http://www.reeseprod.com/products/products/wd_dualcam.shtml.
Or just use the search window at http://www.reeseprod.com.
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thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
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Look - I just don't see what's wrong with using the phrase "distributes tongue weight". What other weight IS there that needs to be held off the ground when you hook up a trailer? (Unless the cargo is shifting around) No, any other "weights" - as you might call them - coming into play are forces generated by the WD system. That's all there is.
_____________________________________________________________________
Tim,
You sound like me about 8 pages back. That was one of MY arguments. Ron proved me wrong and I admit that. One of the reasons it was so hard for me to grasp the WD concept was that "distributes tongue weight" was all I ever heard or read. The fact is a WD system does not distribute tongue weight - saying so causes one to misinterpret.
You said " What other weight IS there that needs to be held off the ground when you hook up a trailer?"
Ron's point from the very first drawing was that tongue weight was never even considered. The job of the WD system is not to hold up or hold off the tongue weight. The job of the WD system is to remove load from the TV's rear axle and distribute load to the TV's front axle and the TT's axles. You seem to be doing a 180 here. I do not have a problem with saying that a WD system allows you to more effectively handle tongue weight.
From Ron's initial post on the top of page 1: It is interesting to note that TT weight and “tongue weight” do not enter into these calculations. The WD hitch does not distribute "tongue weight". It simply removes load from the TV’s rear axle and distributes it to the TV’s front axle and the TT’s axles.
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thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
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I believe it's the exception rather than the rule that someone would interpret "distributes tongue weight" to mean "removes tongue weight".
Tim, I sincerely believe that many people think/thought that you are/were actually removing, distributing or shifting some of the weight at the tongue. I sure did!
* This post was
edited 09/02/04 09:59pm by thomas malenich *
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thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
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Quote:This has been a long and fruitful string. The amount of knowledge I have gained is amazing. But when it comes to definitions I wonder if we should defer not to ourselves but to those who design and create these systems. I suggest we contact a number of manufacturers and see how THIER engineers describe it. Especially if it is going to be locked down in a forum for the world to see.
It would be my pleasure to start sending emails and try to direct these companies to assist us in a true definition. Unless of course this is what Ron does with his engineering degree.
PS: when Ron comes back I am going to create post asking how dual cam anti-sway works.
Hi Batmovan,
Here is a copy of a thread started by drwleggett on 1/27/2002. Do you prefer any of them to any of the ones proposed so far in this thread?:
It has always been my assumption that a weight distributing hitch equally distributes tongue weight between both the tow vehicle and the trailer. This came from talking with RV sales and service folks and the following sources.
Trailer Life quote:
Also known as an ‘equalizing’ hitch, this category includes hitch systems that utilize spring bars that can be placed under tension to distribute a portion of the trailer's hitch weight to the tow vehicle's front axle and the trailer's axles.
http://www.trailerlife.com/rvtech/glossary.cfm#weightdistributinghitch
Reese quote:
Rather than merely supporting the trailer tongue weight (TW), weight distributing hitches apply leverage between the towing vehicle and trailer causing the TW to be carried by all axles of the tow vehicle and trailer.
http://www.reeseprod.com/Wt%20Dist%20Systems.htm
However, in reading posts, there is an alternate view expressed that weight is distributed to ONLY the tow vehicle. I’ve also come across the following sources.
Equal-i-zer quote:
The Equal-i-zer transfers the trailer's tongue-weight evenly to all the axles of the tow vehicle.
http://www.equalizerhitch.com/faq.html
Hitch-Web quote:
A Weight Distributing Hitch is a ballmount with a set of bars that attach to it, which plugs into your 2" square under vehicle receiver and redistributes the tongue weight (hitch weight) of your trailer. Many vehicles can't carry the full tongue weight of a given trailer, and need some of the tongue weight transferred through the frame and pushing down on the front wheels.
http://www.hitch-web.com/wd.asp
So, who is right? Are both right, since it might depend on the particular type of weight distributing hitch one is using? If so, how do you tell the difference? Or is the weight distribution principle the same no matter what hitch or setup is used?
I’ve only towed with a dead weight setup, so I don’t have any personal experience in this area. I’m just trying to make sure I understand the WD principle correctly. Thanks in advance for any and all replies including examples to help clarify this issue.
Wes
98 GMC Suburban K1500 4x4
02 Shadow Cruiser Fun Finder T-160
Notice the 1st definition by Trailer Life says "portion of the trailers hitch weight", the second by Reese says "tongue weight is carried by all axles", and the Hitch-Web definition calls tongue weight and hitch weight the same thing. Very interesting isn't it?????
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tluxon
Kirkland, WA
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Thomas, I read what you were saying about 8 pages ago and I can promise you that I'm not sounding like you were (and largely still are).
If it weren't for the tongue weight bearing down on the rear axle, there wouldn't BE any excess load that you'd want to remove from the rear axle. The tongue weight is the source.
The ONLY reason the tongue weight isn't required in Ron's equations is because of his assumption of the spring bar tension being 1000 pounds each. If you didn't have adequate tongue weight and you had really light vehicles (ALSO not in the equations), that 2000 pounds in your WD system would turn your TV/TT combination into a pair of scissors.
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tluxon
Kirkland, WA
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I think we've succeeded in ensuring that this thread won't be used as a clarifying sticky.
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thomas malenich
sound beach, new york 11789
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Tim,
On page 5 after much discussion Ron proposed these two statements:
So, please consider the following two statements:
1) The WD system distributes tongue weight over both the front and rear axle (that is the purpose of it), and
2) The WD system removes load from the TV's rear axle and distributes it to the TV's front axle and to the TT's axles.
Which of these do you think is the better definition (meaning less subject to misinterpretation) of the purpose of a WD hitch?
I chose #2, Barney chose #2, 20Home Depot chose #2, Ron chose #2, and David chose #2. From there the definition evolved. Recently I have been suggesting that we consider ADDING something like this to our agreed definition :" A weight distribution system also increases the capacity of the receiver." This feature is important.
What do we need to do to convince you that #1 is not as accurate and/or can be more subject to misinterpretation?? Since my arguments are not working, perhaps someone else can chime in here.
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