Hannibal
Tampa Bay Area
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Joined: 04/12/2002
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rcpd34 wrote:Revving within limits isn't bad; I haven't seen anyone say so. 300HP IS 300HP in either a gasser or diesel. However, the diesel will out pull it every time. You can try and eplain your position with theory all you want, but the seat of your pants truth will win out every time. If you guys are happy with your gas engines, then that is great; it works for you. But don't come here and try to say that a factory gas motor will out tow or or even tow as well as a factory diesel in the same truck. It's BS.
Been there. My bone stock '05 Hemi powered 2500HD QC LB Ram with 345hp and 365 ft/lbs of torque would tow 70mph in 2nd at 5k rpm up the same grades that my bone stock '03 SO 250 hp/460ft-lbs would have to slow to 58mph to allow a downshift to direct where it could climb back to 65~mph at 2900rpm. Both quite noisy at those rpm. I like them both. I'd like to come across another 2001.5 6spd/3.55 Cummins Ram in pristine condition. So I'm not going to badmouth either to prop up the other. Doing so doesn't change the fact that horsepower is the determining factor in how fast you can tow up the grade. The variables can be fuel consumption, desired rpm, cringe factor which is a driver problem, not an engine problem and long term engine life beyond what most vehicles last anyhow. But it won't be ability as long as horsepower is equal.
Going back to '95, My '94 F150 with 300cid I6 towed our 4400 lb TT easier than our '95 160hp Cummins Ram. 160hp was barely enough for the truck. But I liked it too for it's mileage and rattle.
2020 F250 STX CC SB 7.3L 10spd 3.55 4x4
2010 F250 XLT CC SB 5.4L 5spdTS 3.73
ex '95 Cummins,'98 12v Cummins,'01.5 Cummins,'03 Cummins; '05 Hemi
2017 Jayco 28RLS TT 32.5'
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transamz9
Lawrenceburg Ky
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Joined: 07/27/2010
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Hannibal wrote:rcpd34 wrote:Revving within limits isn't bad; I haven't seen anyone say so. 300HP IS 300HP in either a gasser or diesel. However, the diesel will out pull it every time. You can try and eplain your position with theory all you want, but the seat of your pants truth will win out every time. If you guys are happy with your gas engines, then that is great; it works for you. But don't come here and try to say that a factory gas motor will out tow or or even tow as well as a factory diesel in the same truck. It's BS.
Been there. My bone stock '05 Hemi powered 2500HD QC LB Ram with 345hp and 365 ft/lbs of torque would tow 70mph in 2nd at 5k rpm up the same grades that my bone stock '03 SO 250 hp/460ft-lbs would have to slow to 58mph to allow a downshift to direct where it could climb back to 65~mph at 2900rpm. Both quite noisy at those rpm. I like them both. I'd like to come across another 2001.5 6spd/3.55 Cummins Ram in pristine condition. So I'm not going to badmouth either to prop up the other. Doing so doesn't change the fact that horsepower is the determining factor in how fast you can tow up the grade. The variables can be fuel consumption, desired rpm, cringe factor which is a driver problem, not an engine problem and long term engine life beyond what most vehicles last anyhow. But it won't be ability as long as horsepower is equal.
Going back to '95, My '94 F150 with 300cid I6 towed our 4400 lb TT easier than our '95 160hp Cummins Ram. 160hp was barely enough for the truck. But I liked it too for it's mileage and rattle.
There again Hannibal, the poster you just quoted stated stame model year truck gas verses diesel stock. My Diesel powered '05 with stock tires will not kick out of overdrive until below 70. I have never hit a hill on the interstate that I couldn't hold 70. Now is it more nerve racking to have a motor screaming at 5000-5500 rpms for miles or 2500-3000. I've had them both to and for the comfort in my book it's the diesel, and I'm not looking for a gas station on the other side of the hill either. The last gasser I had wore my right foot out trying to keep a decent speed on a trip. Gear gown , gear up, gear down, gear up. I guess if I lived on ocean flat lands it would be fine but the roads around here are like roller coasters and gas just wouldn't(won't) do it.
2016 Ram 3500 Mega Cab Limited/2013 Ram 3500 SRW Cummins(sold)/2005 RAM 2500 Cummins/2011 Sandpiper 345 RET (sold) 2015 Sanibel 3601/2008 Nitro Z9 Mercury 250 PRO XS the best motor made.
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Hannibal
Tampa Bay Area
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My '05 was an exact duplicate of my '03 except for the engine and transmission. 545RFE with the Hemi and 47RE with the Cummins. Same 10.5" AAM rear except the Cummins had 4.10 and the Hemi had 3.73. Every hill I hit with Hemi that caused a downshift from direct to 2nd also caused a downshift with the Cummins from O/D to direct towing the same 10,400 lb weighed 5th wheel. The Cummins had to slow down to prevent over revving. Plenty of torque, not enough horsepower. I still stop at the same fuel stops I've always stopped at. Two mpg isn't that drastic a change. Other than the lower half of Florida where we don't go, it's pretty much all rolling hills. Didn't your truck have cruise control?
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transamz9
Lawrenceburg Ky
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Hannibal wrote:My '05 was an exact duplicate of my '03 except for the engine and transmission. 545RFE with the Hemi and 47RE with the Cummins. Same 10.5" AAM rear except the Cummins had 4.10 and the Hemi had 3.73. Every hill I hit with Hemi that caused a downshift from direct to 2nd also caused a downshift with the Cummins from O/D to direct towing the same 10,400 lb weighed 5th wheel. The Cummins had to slow down to prevent over revving. Plenty of torque, not enough horsepower. I still stop at the same fuel stops I've always stopped at. Two mpg isn't that drastic a change. Other than the lower half of Florida where we don't go, it's pretty much all rolling hills. Didn't your truck have cruise control? Yes all of trucks have had cruise and yes when you set cruise with a gas motor towing , it will shift 10X as much as a diesel. You win, you are right, I give up, I'm done. I'll see you on the other side.
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Jarlaxle
New England
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I accept your concession.
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transamz9
Lawrenceburg Ky
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Jarlaxle wrote:I accept your concession.
I will never own another gas truck to tow with. Even my wife that knows nothing about how trucks work asked me when we were pulling our 24' pontoon down the interstate with the 300 HP gas truck we traded a 250 hp diesel in on, (what the hell is wrong with this truck?) Needless to say , it wasn't 6 months of that and we were back in a diesel.![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/scratchead.gif "scratchead")
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Hannibal
Tampa Bay Area
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transamz9 wrote:Hannibal wrote:My '05 was an exact duplicate of my '03 except for the engine and transmission. 545RFE with the Hemi and 47RE with the Cummins. Same 10.5" AAM rear except the Cummins had 4.10 and the Hemi had 3.73. Every hill I hit with Hemi that caused a downshift from direct to 2nd also caused a downshift with the Cummins from O/D to direct towing the same 10,400 lb weighed 5th wheel. The Cummins had to slow down to prevent over revving. Plenty of torque, not enough horsepower. I still stop at the same fuel stops I've always stopped at. Two mpg isn't that drastic a change. Other than the lower half of Florida where we don't go, it's pretty much all rolling hills. Didn't your truck have cruise control? Yes all of trucks have had cruise and yes when you set cruise with a gas motor towing , it will shift 10X as much as a diesel. You win, you are right, I give up, I'm done. I'll see you on the other side.
You should see how much it shifts in town while towing the construction trailer! It's a wonder we make it home at night. Shiftaphobia, like rpmaphobia, is not a tow vehicle weakness. If you're happy with your diesel, that's great. I liked every one of mine. I'm now happy with my gasser. How bout let that be and don't continually tell me I can't do what we've been doing with them for seven years now. That gets old.
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Hannibal
Tampa Bay Area
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transamz9 wrote:Jarlaxle wrote:I accept your concession.
I will never own another gas truck to tow with. Even my wife that knows nothing about how trucks work asked me when we were pulling our 24' pontoon down the interstate with the 300 HP gas truck we traded a 250 hp diesel in on, (what the hell is wrong with this truck?) Needless to say , it wasn't 6 months of that and we were back in a diesel.
Loud whining noise from the driver's seat? Glad you got it fixed!![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/awink.gif "awink")
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transamz9
Lawrenceburg Ky
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What's that suppose to mean?
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RFOneWatt
Detroit, MI
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Joined: 03/15/2010
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64thunderbolt wrote:All I can say is all you gasser owners come out west and try some of our mtns and you'll see how quickly the gassers die on the pulls we have. If you haven't been out here and pulled the grades we deal with you don't know what it's like. All the theories in the world don't mean anything. Come put your truck up beside a diesel on these mtn grades and find out.
What he said. For real.
Yes, I have read all 200 pages of this thread.
Yes, I've been out west EXTENSIVELY (Utah,Wyoming,Colorado,Nevada,Arizona) in both gas tow vehicles and diesel tow vehicles pulling the exact same trailer.
After you've done it (It only takes one time) you will soon realize:
THERE IS NO DEBATE.
The bottom line is if you need a diesel YOU WILL KNOW IT and hopefully you will not find out too late like I did. (grumble, grumble)
At the end of the day just drive what makes you SAFE, happy, comfortable and the least fatigued when you get to your destination.
-RF
BTW -- Lots of talk about going UP HILL...
How's about the differences going DOWN HILL.
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