mountaintraveler
mountains
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pnichols wrote:If I was a bit younger and much richer, I think I'd consider this - 19'8" long and AWD - probably install a bit taller tires on it for more ground clearance, though:
https://pleasureway.com/models/ontour20/
By the way, its built on Ford Transit 250 which means little over 6 inches clearance, that's about the same as my class C. If I were richer I'd want some real offroad vehicle, a 4x4 raised truck with huge monster tires and fancy camper top, with over a foot of clearance.
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klutchdust
Orange, California
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Something to think about if you own a generator.
"After a prolonged period of running without load, the engine will start to incompletely combust the fuel due to a lack of running hot enough and burning off the unburnt hydrocarbons.
To correct this situation, the generator should be run at nearly full load to warm up and burn off all the built-up soot buildup and unburnt fuel.
Running the generator at a high load for several hours will ensure that the combustion process in the engine is optimal and will extend the durability of the engine."
I always added a fuel additive to the MH and was sure to exercise the generator on a regular basis. On portable generators, I have 3, I always turn the fuel off while the engine is running and let them run out of fuel. No sticky carburetors that way.
The old school fuel additives do not work as well as some of the new ones marketed today.
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opnspaces
San Diego Ca
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Joined: 12/22/2004
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mountaintraveler wrote:
I had run it from sea level to around 8000ft. My manual says that running it with higher altitude setting at low altitude will damage the generator. Not sure about the other way, but its supposed to sputter, surge, run poorly if altitude is high and isn't set in the generator. May be its not noticeable with newer generator in top shape.
This is how the above works. Your generator needs a mixture of fuel and air in the correct ratio of air to fuel to work properly (14.7 parts of air to 1 part of fuel is correct).
Say you set that mixture at sea level. Now when you go up to 8,000 feet there is less air. So if you make no changes then you might have 8 parts of air to 1 part of fuel. (that ratio is completely made up but the point is still valid). There ratio has too much fuel and not enough air. That is known as a rich condition which can cause sputter surge and loss of power. But it doesn't destroy the engine.
However, if you are at 8,000 feet elevation and you set your generator correctly so it has a 14:1 ratio everything is fine and your generator is happy. But when you go back to sea level there is a whole bunch more air. So you might now have a ratio of 20:1 (20 parts of air to each part of fuel) That is known as a lean condition and is very bad. When an engine is running lean it is running hot and can destroy itself in a short amount of time.
2001 Suburban 4x4. 6.0L, 4.10 3/4 ton
2005 Jayco Jay Flight 27BH
1986 Coleman Columbia Popup.
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mountaintraveler
mountains
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klutchdust wrote:Something to think about if you own a generator.
"After a prolonged period of running without load, the engine will start to incompletely combust the fuel due to a lack of running hot enough and burning off the unburnt hydrocarbons.
To correct this situation, the generator should be run at nearly full load to warm up and burn off all the built-up soot buildup and unburnt fuel.
Running the generator at a high load for several hours will ensure that the combustion process in the engine is optimal and will extend the durability of the engine."
I always added a fuel additive to the MH and was sure to exercise the generator on a regular basis. On portable generators, I have 3, I always turn the fuel off while the engine is running and let them run out of fuel. No sticky carburetors that way.
The old school fuel additives do not work as well as some of the new ones marketed today.
I try to add Seafoam every time. Some hook up fuel line to a can with lots of seafoam added to gas and run it like that to clear the gunk. I do not like gas generators and cant wait until I sell this one. My cheap backup propane generator meets my emergency needs and doesnt need to be exercised, according to manufacturer (my regular needs are met by a cheap solar panel). This one solar panel charges all my electronics, blender, lithium batteries for my power tools, vacuum cleaner, recharges house battery just fine, the rest of my stuff operates off propane and I dont need A/C
* This post was
edited 09/17/23 10:55pm by mountaintraveler *
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mountaintraveler
mountains
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opnspaces wrote:mountaintraveler wrote:
I had run it from sea level to around 8000ft. My manual says that running it with higher altitude setting at low altitude will damage the generator. Not sure about the other way, but its supposed to sputter, surge, run poorly if altitude is high and isn't set in the generator. May be its not noticeable with newer generator in top shape.
This is how the above works. Your generator needs a mixture of fuel and air in the correct ratio of air to fuel to work properly (14.7 parts of air to 1 part of fuel is correct).
Say you set that mixture at sea level. Now when you go up to 8,000 feet there is less air. So if you make no changes then you might have 8 parts of air to 1 part of fuel. (that ratio is completely made up but the point is still valid). There ratio has too much fuel and not enough air. That is known as a rich condition which can cause sputter surge and loss of power. But it doesn't destroy the engine.
However, if you are at 8,000 feet elevation and you set your generator correctly so it has a 14:1 ratio everything is fine and your generator is happy. But when you go back to sea level there is a whole bunch more air. So you might now have a ratio of 20:1 (20 parts of air to each part of fuel) That is known as a lean condition and is very bad. When an engine is running lean it is running hot and can destroy itself in a short amount of time.
The altitude adjustment knob (plastic) is actually missing, the way I bought it, and I use pliers to set altitude as the dial markings and the metal knob housing are intact, per advice from Cummings tech support and they said altitude settings are very approximate. The whole design is ridiculous as they do not sell replacement knobs and require expensive carbureator replacement if this piece of plasic falls off, while all it would take is to seat the plastic back into its housing. To me it all is expensive scam and I'm looking forward to life free of gas or diesel generators once I sell.
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pnichols
The Other California
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mountaintraveler wrote:pnichols wrote:If I was a bit younger and much richer, I think I'd consider this - 19'8" long and AWD - probably install a bit taller tires on it for more ground clearance, though:
https://pleasureway.com/models/ontour20/
LOL 180K!
I grew up in a world where most roads were dirt (deep dirt, the kind that sinks army tanks) and camping was simple and inexpensive activity, in rough norther climate.
Look what they did to this now...And these are rapidly depreciating assets, costing as much as a house that is going to only appreciate (while one spends equal amount of money on regular maintenance)
They're going to force electric vehicles pretty soon, I'm sure, what's going to become of the value of these overpriced vans...when it'll be hard and very expensive to buy any fuel.
Class C and many class Bs are overbuilt and have too many "amenities" I have no use for. I don't need entertainment system/TV, on-board generator, 2nd sink, big bed, oven, multiple stove burners (need one), microwave, outside shower, dinette, can do without A/C and 6 gallon water heater (1 gal heater is fine with me, with 6 gal I just waste propane).
So it'd make sense to build something I want on my own, with own hands as they charge insane money for builds, or gut a small trailer to make more storage space. But I won't travel after this last big trip as want to settle into small farming life.
I don't need a generator except for emergency, my cheap solar panel meets all my needs. I have to run Onan on board generator every couple of weeks to avoid clogged carburetor, which gives me headache as I hate fumes, noise and have to set new altitude every time and my altitude switch is finicky, got to change to summer oil, have to worry about fuel varnishing and fuel quality for that expensive, picky generator - and I have to run electric heater outside, heating the forest to load that generator properly! I prefer my cheap 2nd carry-on dual fuel Pulsar generator, one kind of oil for all weather, and I only use propane - no fuel rot, no mess or smell, no exercising it. On-board Onan seems to require convoluted procedure to prepare it for storage, much more than draining the carbureator, so can't just keep it shut down.
Ann Cat ... since this is a Class C forum section ... what year/brand of Class C do you have?
My good old E450 based 2005 Itasca (Winnebago) 24 ft. Class C I bought new in 2006 came stock with all those "luxuries" that I guess you're saying you don't need. The DW and myself use them all when drycamping - whether drycamping in a campground or drycamping out on the far side of beyond.
We never drive through an entrance leading to the middle of nowhere without having first topped up our 55 gallon gasoline tank, which gives our built-in Onan genny plenty of run-time - in addition to what the V10 might need to get us back to civilization. I also carry along a portable genny along with it's own gas supply so as to provide coach battery charging backup - to either the Onan charging of the batteries (plus running all other electrical gadgets) or idling of the V10 to charge the batteries. I never adjust the Onan's altitude setting - just leave it on sea level all the time.
I maintain positive air pressure inside the coach whenever running either of the two generators or idling of the V10 - so as to use physics to absolutely keep out any/all fumes ... and it works like a champ.
It sure is nice to have inside or outside showers, perfect coach interior temperatures regardless of outside temps, plenty of refrigerator/freezer cubic footage, 3 stovetop burners if needed, an oven if needed, a large 12V fan with a long extension cord to blow on us when sitting outside under the awning in hot outside temps, a lounge chair for reading or watching of movies when not outside, large storage tanks, two queen size beds for complete sleeping comfort, 5 ways of recharging the coach batteries anytime anywhere (we don't have/need solar - yet) and higher-than-stock rough road clearance due to my use of tires with a larger diameter than what came stock on our Class C. All of this is supported via an overkill E450 chassis for added strength and durability that took me a long time to locate under a 24 ft. Class C ... which are usually built on only an E350 chassis.
The infuriating part is that all the above set us back only around $54K when we bought new back in the day. What a rip'off todays RV prices are!
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2005 E450 Itasca 24V Class C
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mountaintraveler
mountains
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pnichols wrote:mountaintraveler wrote:pnichols wrote:If I was a bit younger and much richer, I think I'd consider this - 19'8" long and AWD - probably install a bit taller tires on it for more ground clearance, though:
https://pleasureway.com/models/ontour20/
LOL 180K!
I grew up in a world where most roads were dirt (deep dirt, the kind that sinks army tanks) and camping was simple and inexpensive activity, in rough norther climate.
Look what they did to this now...And these are rapidly depreciating assets, costing as much as a house that is going to only appreciate (while one spends equal amount of money on regular maintenance)
They're going to force electric vehicles pretty soon, I'm sure, what's going to become of the value of these overpriced vans...when it'll be hard and very expensive to buy any fuel.
Class C and many class Bs are overbuilt and have too many "amenities" I have no use for. I don't need entertainment system/TV, on-board generator, 2nd sink, big bed, oven, multiple stove burners (need one), microwave, outside shower, dinette, can do without A/C and 6 gallon water heater (1 gal heater is fine with me, with 6 gal I just waste propane).
So it'd make sense to build something I want on my own, with own hands as they charge insane money for builds, or gut a small trailer to make more storage space. But I won't travel after this last big trip as want to settle into small farming life.
I don't need a generator except for emergency, my cheap solar panel meets all my needs. I have to run Onan on board generator every couple of weeks to avoid clogged carburetor, which gives me headache as I hate fumes, noise and have to set new altitude every time and my altitude switch is finicky, got to change to summer oil, have to worry about fuel varnishing and fuel quality for that expensive, picky generator - and I have to run electric heater outside, heating the forest to load that generator properly! I prefer my cheap 2nd carry-on dual fuel Pulsar generator, one kind of oil for all weather, and I only use propane - no fuel rot, no mess or smell, no exercising it. On-board Onan seems to require convoluted procedure to prepare it for storage, much more than draining the carbureator, so can't just keep it shut down.
Ann Cat ... since this is a Class C forum section ... what year/brand of Class C do you have?
My good old E450 based 2005 Itasca (Winnebago) 24 ft. Class C I bought new in 2006 came stock with all those "luxuries" that I guess you're saying you don't need. The DW and myself use them all when drycamping - whether drycamping in a campground or drycamping out on the far side of beyond.
We never drive through an entrance leading to the middle of nowhere without having first topped up our 55 gallon gasoline tank, which gives our built-in Onan genny plenty of run-time - in addition to what the V10 might need to get us back to civilization. I also carry along a portable genny along with it's own gas supply so as to provide coach battery charging backup - to either the Onan charging of the batteries (plus running all other electrical gadgets) or idling of the V10 to charge the batteries. I never adjust the Onan's altitude setting - just leave it on sea level all the time.
I maintain positive air pressure inside the coach whenever running either of the two generators or idling of the V10 - so as to use physics to absolutely keep out any/all fumes ... and it works like a champ.
It sure is nice to have inside or outside showers, perfect coach interior temperatures regardless of outside temps, plenty of refrigerator/freezer cubic footage, 3 stovetop burners if needed, an oven if needed, a large 12V fan with a long extension cord to blow on us when sitting outside under the awning in hot outside temps, a lounge chair for reading or watching of movies when not outside, large storage tanks, two queen size beds for complete sleeping comfort, 5 ways of recharging the coach batteries anytime anywhere (we don't have/need solar - yet) and higher-than-stock rough road clearance due to my use of tires with a larger diameter than what came stock on our Class C. All of this is supported via an overkill E450 chassis for added strength and durability that took me a long time to locate under a 24 ft. Class C ... which are usually built on only an E350 chassis.
The infuriating part is that all the above set us back only around $54K when we bought new back in the day. What a rip'off todays RV prices are!
My RV is 2012.
I don't need most of the overbloated stuff installed into it, especially this Onan generator which I intensely hate to run. All the junk only causes me worry it breaks before I resell the RV which I had purchased to do one long Western trip.
The Onan fumes are going to be all over outside the rv, and once you open the door to step out they will be in, I have to step out multiple times, can't be sitting in like a prisoner, to begin with I have to run electrical heater outsude to properlty load that crazy maddening genset to exercise it to 1/2 of capacity! Can't stand noise or vibration too. Can't stand sound of generators. Portable quiet propane genny which is cheap can be run far away on a long extension cord and does not need to be exercised.
I do not need to charge my batteries much, they last me forever plus there is solar option or I just drive some. I hardly ever run furnace, I just travel following nice weather.
I do not need a shower, I use 1 gal bucket baths for 2-3 weeks until I shower in the gym. Outside shower is just extra freezing hazard
Do not need microwave, sound system, TV, do not need 6 gal water heater, ducted furnace, ceiling fans, 2nd sink, oven, 4 burner stove, wooden cabinets, queen bed. That's not my lifestyle and I am camping. I don't stay in rv parks.
The only useful thing is flush toilet, that's the real reason I went with class C and not a van. Also like big storage capacity. Fridge and air heater I can install it myself or hire someone to install into anything. Would want lots of solar and my cheap portable genny that runs off propane hooked to portable tanks, not the RV big onboard tank which got expensive valves, can be easily damaged by propane place overfilling it and you will be looking into over 1k to replace it. Lots of expensive junk installed to milk money out of people, whole industry is a scam.
Class C frame got high clearance I don't understand why they did not use the clearance and stuffed the bottom with features, may be the tall height requires balancing or something
I like Bob Wells CheapRVLiving approach better and if I was doing it all over again and looking for something long term, not a one big trip thing, I would go with cargo trailer option with high clearance truck and may be even install flush toilet and tanks into it. I just did not have time or space for conversion since I lived while traveling in short term rentals all over when I bought the RV. I'm moving overseas soon, will not be changing the rig, I'm fine with what I got for the puposes of my trip.
* This post was
edited 11/13/23 11:51am by mountaintraveler *
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pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
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Joined: 12/18/2004
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mountain ah for the simple life!
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.
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mountaintraveler
mountains
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Joined: 12/17/2022
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pianotuna wrote:mountain ah for the simple life!
Just one look at any RV forum tech section...right now someone here says their onan genset fuel filter got crossthreaded, so Onan are quoting $2400 to replace the entire bottom! That's 6 times more that my entire portable dual fuel generator cost brand new, and I never even need much load.
Lots of fragile, easily damaged, high maintenace stuff.
And places like Onan requre leaving the RV with them for unknown length of time.
Simple, basic is the best.
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mountaintraveler
mountains
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By the way I got portable shower with a pump that cost me 25 bucks, and 2 gallon folding bucket that cost me 10 bucks and has multiple uses. It is much lower flow than any RV shower head and I modified it further to get extremely low flow. It can be used inside, outside. I never use built-in showers, too much water loss for boondocking. It does not risk freezing or flooding the RV from water line leak.
I just read on here how someone's microwave got busted and they were quoted $1200 by the RV maker. They got "lucky" finding cheaper one for $500. Small microwave should not cost more than 50 bucks... Now I'm especially afraid to use my microwave, but not that I ever need it and I have A/C power only twice a month when I exercise the generator.
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