Huntindog
Phoenix AZ
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cougar28 wrote:
Lets do the math. So I can use 30 amps 24/7 that's 86.4 kwh per day
Ok now the RV is pulling 20 amps 24/7 (which it will not because things turning on and off) that's 57.6 kwh per day
A 1500 watt heater plug into the 120v pole outlet because that's over amps the RV 30 amp breaker by 2.5 amps. Let say it heating for 30 mins and off 30 mins that's heating for 12 hr. That's 18 kwh per day
Ok by that 57.6 kwh + 18 kwh = 75.6 kwh used. So 86.4 kwh - 75.6 kwh = 10.8 kwh that's not used.So calling them a thief is a little harsh when there not.I bet my figure is pretty dang close if not a little on the high side. Your math works ONLY if your park is on the standard (usually most expensive KW rate)
There are rates in which there is a demand/peak charge as well. These are pretty popular as the cost per KW is quite a bit cheaper..... But those savings evaporate in a hurry if the demand/peak usage spikes.... And when ones breakers pop, that is exactly what is happening.
I am not going to get into math, as the rates vary wildly around the country. But this is a fact.
The power companies are concerned about peak/demand loads as they must have standby generation on hand to cover those loads whenever they occur. This costs money. So they have come up with these rate plans to encourage customers to manage their peak/demand loads.... And penalize those that do a bad job of it.
* This post was
edited 11/16/19 12:43am by Huntindog *
Huntindog
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Huntindog
Phoenix AZ
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dieseltruckdriver wrote:Huntindog wrote:Not at all.
I think that whatever your 30 amp service can provide is justified.
But some seem the think that running another cord from a seperate outlet is OK.... I do not. Some even have gone to the trouble of adding a seperate way to get the power into their 30 amp unit... That in my eyes is theft. Often the park operator will just overlook it, as they do not want a confrontation. It is kind of like shoplifting. Everyone pays for it in the form of higher prices.
50 amp service generally costs more, as the park understands the electricity use will be higher
Well I have a separate outlet just for a space heater that plugs in to the 15 amp outlet. I have never been to a place that charges different fees for 30 or 50 amp service.
So explain how having that outlet that makes me a thief. I do it to ease the load on the rv wiring.
Broad generalizations really shouldn't be made.
When you do such a mod to "ease" the load on your TTs 30 amp service,,,, It allows you to consume more than 30 amps...If and only IF the electric cost is the same at the park for 30 or 50 amp, then this would be OK.. It just means that the park has decided to make their 30 amp customers subsidize their 50 amp customers.
But don't pull out the generalization line.
We all know that electricity costs money. 50 amp service costs more than 30 amp service. Somebody will pay for it. The park is not in business to be a charity for those that try to cheat.
* This post was
edited 11/16/19 01:47am by Huntindog *
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pasusan
Northernmost PA
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Lantley wrote:CFerguson wrote:Wow, 5 pages in and only one person has pointed out that not using the furnace just may endanger your water tanks and lines. Sure on some RVs it wont matter, but on many others it certainly does.
Pennywise and pound foolish?
For starters it generally takes 24 hours of sub freezing temps to cause issues to a heated RV. Temps below freezing for a few hours overnight will not create problems for most RV's with an enclosed underbelly.
Most RV'ers are not in extreme cold, yes it may dip below freezing overnight but the temps warm to above freezing during the day. THose moderately cold conditions are ideal for space heaters.
The idea that your tanks will freeze if you use space heaters is overblown. Yes it may happen in extreme conditions But if the cabin is warm/heated heat will naturally radiate and protect the plumbing.
Leaving a cabinet door open or using a light bulb in the basement also helps.
Your plumbing does not automatically freeze in cold weather if space heaters are used.
Temps must be well below freezing or remain below freezing for 24 hours or longer before there is a high risk of freezing pipes. Lantley is right. We've camped in our trailer when it's gotten down to 24* when I woke up and checked. During the day it got up into the 50s. We use electric heat - sometimes a space heater, sometimes the heater in the air conditioner. Nothing happens to the plumbing and we don't even have an enclosed underbelly. I will say that we never have water hooked up - always use the tank and pump.
What kind of space heater do we use? A Vornado. It circulates the air and keeps the temperatures even all throughout the camper.
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pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
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The campground sets the price. If it includes power, then I am not "stealing". That idea is ludicrous.
Regards, Don
My ride is a 28 foot Class C, 256 watts solar, 556 amp-hours of Telcom jars, 3000 watt Magnum hybrid inverter, Sola Basic Autoformer, Microair Easy Start.
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Huntindog
Phoenix AZ
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pianotuna wrote:The campground sets the price. If it includes power, then I am not "stealing". That idea is ludicrous. It is if you take more than you pay for....
I don't know how many times I have to say it....
IF you are paying for 30 amp service, then you are entitled to draw 30 amps. Not 40, 50 etc. but 30. If the campgound has just one set price for any electric service, (30 or 50) then you are entitled to use more.
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pianotuna
Regina, SK, Canada
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Huntindog wrote:pianotuna wrote:The campground sets the price. If it includes power, then I am not "stealing". That idea is ludicrous. It is if you take more than you pay for....
I don't know how many times I have to say it....
IF you are paying for 30 amp service, then you are entitled to draw 30 amps. Not 40, 50 etc. but 30. If the campgound has just one set price for any electric service, (30 or 50) then you are entitled to use more.
Apparently you did not read what I wrote. "The campground sets the price". If I use what they provide I am NOT stealing. If I plugged into a 2nd pedestal--that would be theft. If I pay for 30 amps and use 24 (maximum continuous load), it is not.
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Huntindog
Phoenix AZ
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pianotuna wrote:Huntindog wrote:pianotuna wrote:The campground sets the price. If it includes power, then I am not "stealing". That idea is ludicrous. It is if you take more than you pay for....
I don't know how many times I have to say it....
IF you are paying for 30 amp service, then you are entitled to draw 30 amps. Not 40, 50 etc. but 30. If the campgound has just one set price for any electric service, (30 or 50) then you are entitled to use more.
Apparently you did not read what I wrote. "The campground sets the price". If I use what they provide I am NOT stealing. If I plugged into a 2nd pedestal--that would be theft. If I pay for 30 amps and use 24 (maximum continuous load), it is not.
And I never said anything different.
On edit: BUT>>>> This does not entitle you to us 40 amps one hour, and 20 the next.
Electricity cost money. The amount of electricty cost money.
AND How fast you use it also costs money.
The campgound has a right to expect that a 30 amp rig will only draw 30 amps at any given time.
* This post was
edited 11/16/19 10:20am by Huntindog *
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Gdetrailer
PA
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Joined: 01/05/2007
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pianotuna wrote:The campground sets the price. If it includes power, then I am not "stealing". That idea is ludicrous.
Campground does "set the price" but that price is set by reviewing ALL of their expenses (labor, maintenance and all other costs of business) from the PREVIOUS YEAR. If cost has gone up, they WILL be forced to raise the campground rates to cover the costs and to draw some sort of income that they can live on.
The "elephant in the room" is that you and many others are ignoring the fact that what you use now WILL affect the campground prices NEXT YEAR.
SO, if "everyone" that is "entitled" to 30A or 50A AND uses every bit of it, it WILL cost the campground more in operation expense.
YOU are not being "wise consumers" or being "green" energy wise by deciding to be sloppy electric energy hogs..
One of the biggest gripes on this forum is the PRICE INCREASES or how much more expensive it has gotten at their favorite campgrounds every year, electric costs play a huge part in the price of admission to your favorite campgrounds.
Piano, your post really outlines the real truth of today's SELFISH VIEWS that the average human has now days.. The "what is in it for me" mentality of today pretty much ruins things for everyone tomorrow.
I put this current day selfish view in the same category as all of the EV owners that seem to believe that they are being "green" and are entitled to "free" electricity everywhere (campgrounds too) and still drive on the same public roads without paying their fair share of the ROAD TAXES!
Electricity is not free, it has a real cost and the more we consume the higher it will cost. That IS how electric companies in the USA are structured to bill..
Your used to Canada's power, Canada may have a lot of "free" energy from "Hydro dams" but it too still has real costs to maintain and it is not free to generate and distribute that power, Canada gov absorbs that cost and ALL will eventually end up paying more for ALL of your goods..
Today's motto should be abuse it now and leave nothing behind for my kids, grand kids to have in the future..
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Naio
Snug as a bug in a rug
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If the people who are using 30 amps + 15 amps are supposed to pay more, does that mean I get a discount for my van that only has a 15 amp service?
I also don't use the sewer dump, the cable TV, and usually don't use the water hose. Do I get a discount for all these things?
3/4 timing in a DIY van conversion. Backroads, mountains, boondocking, sometimes big cities for a change of pace.
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Huntindog
Phoenix AZ
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Naio wrote:If the people who are using 30 amps + 15 amps are supposed to pay more, does that mean I get a discount for my van that only has a 15 amp service?
I also don't use the sewer dump, the cable TV, and usually don't use the water hose. Do I get a discount for all these things?
Again, out of context. If a park has seperate fees for 30 or 50 amp service, then one is not entitled to use more than that.
Itf there were enough people only using 15 amps then you would likely see a lower fee for that use.
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