D1trout wrote:
Gents, thanks for your support and your observations. Garry, I have thought thru the bath issue and my shower pan drain will go thru one of the spaces between frame members on the right side of the door. The gray water tank will be directly below the shower. I will be using a cassette toilet, so no need for a black water tank and plumbing.
The fiberglass "bustle", as I've come to refer to it, will be sealed. That means that I'm reglassing it to eliminate the existing hatches and access panels. Then I'll put proper sealable plastic marine-style hatches in the bottom and sides to make a dirt, dust and water-free storage space, with access when necessary. I'm going to use a garden hose for draining the gray water tank. Trying to keep the plumbing as simple as possible.
That part of the new existing frame that fills the rear compartment behind the two side panels weighs about 35 pounds, not counting those lengths that extend forward towards the front of the camper. The 1.5"x1.5"x1/8th inch wall tubing is 0.8 pounds per foot.
The steps are the double folding style that Garry has on his rig and visible in his undercarriage picture. I added the extra tube just behind the threshold of the door to give a solid member to bolt the front of the step to. The back will bolt to the frame member further in. If it appears it will need more support - that seems unlikely, but perhaps so - I'll put a solid aluminum plate on the frame at the point where the steps will mount to keep everything rigid.
Just drawing up the Tyvek pattern for the bulkhead to get Gary going on that. Going to put a big sliding window in it to allow access - for dogs anyway - to the front of the truck.
Also thinking to redesign the interior to a front dinette style. I prefer that arrangement. It means relocating propane tanks but I have some thoughts about that.
Onward!
Dick
Gents, thanks for your support and your observations. Garry, I have thought thru the bath issue and my shower pan drain will go thru one of the spaces between frame members on the right side of the door. The gray water tank will be directly below the shower. I will be using a cassette toilet, so no need for a black water tank and plumbing.
The fiberglass "bustle", as I've come to refer to it, will be sealed. That means that I'm reglassing it to eliminate the existing hatches and access panels. Then I'll put proper sealable plastic marine-style hatches in the bottom and sides to make a dirt, dust and water-free storage space, with access when necessary. I'm going to use a garden hose for draining the gray water tank. Trying to keep the plumbing as simple as possible.
That part of the new existing frame that fills the rear compartment behind the two side panels weighs about 35 pounds, not counting those lengths that extend forward towards the front of the camper. The 1.5"x1.5"x1/8th inch wall tubing is 0.8 pounds per foot.
The steps are the double folding style that Garry has on his rig and visible in his undercarriage picture. I added the extra tube just behind the threshold of the door to give a solid member to bolt the front of the step to. The back will bolt to the frame member further in. If it appears it will need more support - that seems unlikely, but perhaps so - I'll put a solid aluminum plate on the frame at the point where the steps will mount to keep everything rigid.
Just drawing up the Tyvek pattern for the bulkhead to get Gary going on that. Going to put a big sliding window in it to allow access - for dogs anyway - to the front of the truck.
Also thinking to redesign the interior to a front dinette style. I prefer that arrangement. It means relocating propane tanks but I have some thoughts about that.
Onward!
Dick
Good morning Dick,
Knowing that you are utilizing the same steps that I have, I would definitely reinforce some more. My frame work is a pair of 2x4's that we're notched on top to sandwich a 3ftx3ft by 3/8" thick aluminum plate, then there is 3/4" plywood screwed down to the 2x4's, fully sandwiching in the aluminum plate. The steps are then bolted through the steps through the 2x4's through the aluminum plate with very long carriage bolts. The plywood insoles for the carriage bolts has a drilled relief so that the vinyl flooring sits flush. It may sound like overkill, but with the rear of my camper unsupported by the truck, and the tripple step extending out almost 3 ft, there is a lot of leverage force at work. With the setup I have, my 350+lb friend has come into the camper several times, and no issues. Additionally, I have kids that like to bound down the steps or up the steps, that can be a large shock load(think 6 ft 180llb teenage boy bouncing onto the steps.) this has been very comforting to know anyone that can climb the stairs and fit through the door can come visit, without worry if the steps failing. So I may overbuilt it, but I don't have to worry about tearing it all apart later to redo it.
I hope this helps in your design and layout.
Keep the pics coming!
Garry in wet rainy Kodiak.
Garry K
Wife + 4 kids
Retired Military Family.... Alway's on the move....
2002 F350 CCSB 5.4 6spd 4x4 in AK
1966 Avion C-10 Truck Camper
67avion wrote:
I want to get the collective knowledge of the Avionistas on the subject of solar power. I am interested in putting together a solar array. I estimate that I need around 250-300 watts to serve my 3 AGM series 31 batteries which I believe have about 280 Amp Hours.
I'm talking to the guys at Wind and Sun in Flagstaff and they have a kit with 2 Kyocera panels totaling 280 watts, with all the controllers, etc for $870. I also talked to an installer in Flagstaff who estimated (since he has not seen my camper) that the install would run in the neighborhood of $550 to $850. Total between $1400 and $1700. That seems high to me, but then the guys out there do them all the time and it should be a good install.
I've also talked to my local RV guy who has performed miracles on my electrical system. He is a highly adept guy, but hasn't done many solar installs in general and none on a truck camper.
He is interested in doing mine, however, to extend his expertise. We haven't talked money at this point. But, like I said, I have a lot of confidence in him.
We agree that the curve of the roof is a bit of an issue. Here is his solution.
He suggests installing aluminum tubes, east-west, that will be attached to the structural ribs of the Avion's roof...and then attaching the solar panels to the tubing. He believes it will minimize the danger of leaks that can occur when the "Z bracket" mounting feet are set in the roof. While we haven't really investigated my roof real estate for the exact placement, we have agreed that we can run the wires down the unused refrigerator vent. The charge controller and other gear will go in the upper cabinet next to the stove.
I hope this is making some sense in terms of my description. Does anyone have any ideas about this project both in terms of installation as well as costs?
Does anyone have solar on their Avion TC?
I want to get the collective knowledge of the Avionistas on the subject of solar power. I am interested in putting together a solar array. I estimate that I need around 250-300 watts to serve my 3 AGM series 31 batteries which I believe have about 280 Amp Hours.
I'm talking to the guys at Wind and Sun in Flagstaff and they have a kit with 2 Kyocera panels totaling 280 watts, with all the controllers, etc for $870. I also talked to an installer in Flagstaff who estimated (since he has not seen my camper) that the install would run in the neighborhood of $550 to $850. Total between $1400 and $1700. That seems high to me, but then the guys out there do them all the time and it should be a good install.
I've also talked to my local RV guy who has performed miracles on my electrical system. He is a highly adept guy, but hasn't done many solar installs in general and none on a truck camper.
He is interested in doing mine, however, to extend his expertise. We haven't talked money at this point. But, like I said, I have a lot of confidence in him.
We agree that the curve of the roof is a bit of an issue. Here is his solution.
He suggests installing aluminum tubes, east-west, that will be attached to the structural ribs of the Avion's roof...and then attaching the solar panels to the tubing. He believes it will minimize the danger of leaks that can occur when the "Z bracket" mounting feet are set in the roof. While we haven't really investigated my roof real estate for the exact placement, we have agreed that we can run the wires down the unused refrigerator vent. The charge controller and other gear will go in the upper cabinet next to the stove.
I hope this is making some sense in terms of my description. Does anyone have any ideas about this project both in terms of installation as well as costs?
Does anyone have solar on their Avion TC?
Hey Dennis,
I'll be following this, since I am looking at a similar setup. Have you also looked at the wind generators? There are many times in Alaska where I would be better served with a wind generator than a solar setup, but they each have their challenges in our Avions. Some of our challenges is where to put the batteries. Next is as you mentioned, how to mount the solar, then there are all the controllers, and wiring. Wind generators need a ladder on the back to mount to, and a place to store when traveling... All challenges that need to be worked out. I would like to add a ladder to the back of my C10, but it will have to be a custom unit, so I do not exceed 25ft truck and camper for the ferry use to get on and off Kodiak. Being a fishing port, aluminum tubing and sheet stock is readily available, but having tubing bent can get pricey...
Where did you mount your three battery bank?
Keep us in the loop,
Garry
Ford F-350 4x4 Diesel
1988 Avion Triple Axle Trailer
1969 Avion C-11 Camper
Here is a view of one of the three batteries. It is located under the seat of the camper. Although its an AGM battery, I have it secured inside of a battery box where I can strap it.
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/battery_zpsa394882f.jpg.html)
This is a view of the entire set-up with the third battery inserted at the very end of the enclosure. I have to remove the sofa backboard to get to the last battery. They are wired to the truck alternator as well as through the internal wiring of the camper. I have pre-wired the camper with a 4 gauge line that extends from the battery bank to the cabinet in anticipation of installing solar panels.
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/battery1_zpsdb06b4b8.jpg.html)
I learned later ( and you can sure learn almost too much about batteries) that it is not best to mix two brands of batteries with different amp hour ratings. I have one DieHard Platinum, and two Blue Top Optimas AGM batteries. Then you're supposed to wire them together in a different pattern so that the end ones don't charge more )or less) than the middle one. I have no idea how they will be affected...we'll see.
BTW Garry, congrats on being poster number 2,000 on this amazing string.
D
I removed the AC and installed a vent in its place. So, my thinking is that I can:
(1) Close up the center vent and use all that real estate
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/roof3_zpscba342c2.jpg.html)
(2) Place a panel east west in a spot where it avoids the curves of the roof
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/roof1_zps62d0dd3b.jpg.html)
(3) Place several panels on the roof curves
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/roof2_zps3f421dcf.jpg.html)
I think that the better idea is to close the center vent and install in that area, but I'm not sure.
69 what is the size of your 250 watt panel?
Ideas? Comments?
* This post was edited 01/29/14 03:23pm by 67avion *
A question prompted by your picture of the battery compartment: what I'm looking at in that pic is an inner cabinet to house the batteries that is built over the wing and the side of the camper bed box? In other words, you built an inner side and top to create the space for the batteries? The pic got me thinking about how one might make a section of the wing lift up to access the pick up bed for storage, water, propane, or... Though not for batteries; it seems to me they need to be permanent part of the interior of the camper. I'm thinking to put mine in the bottom of the closet opposite the bath, but reality may not bear out that strategy.
Dick
Dick
D1trout wrote:
A question prompted by your picture of the battery compartment: what I'm looking at in that pic is an inner cabinet to house the batteries that is built over the wing and the side of the camper bed box? In other words, you built an inner side and top to create the space for the batteries? The pic got me thinking about how one might make a section of the wing lift up to access the pick up bed for storage, water, propane, or... Though not for batteries; it seems to me they need to be permanent part of the interior of the camper. I'm thinking to put mine in the bottom of the closet opposite the bath, but reality may not bear out that strategy.
A question prompted by your picture of the battery compartment: what I'm looking at in that pic is an inner cabinet to house the batteries that is built over the wing and the side of the camper bed box? In other words, you built an inner side and top to create the space for the batteries? The pic got me thinking about how one might make a section of the wing lift up to access the pick up bed for storage, water, propane, or... Though not for batteries; it seems to me they need to be permanent part of the interior of the camper. I'm thinking to put mine in the bottom of the closet opposite the bath, but reality may not bear out that strategy.
The area that contains the batteries was originally, on my coach, a storage area under the seat. In the photo you can see a view with the cushions removed. You will note several hinges and a cut out that, when raised, showed the batteries.
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/hatch_zpscea462d0.jpg.html)
Once the seat is pulled out to make into a bed you can see a hatch that allows access to the area in front of the rear wheel. The wooden support on the right folds down over the area to create the structure of the bed.
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/hatch1_zps9753dd20.jpg.html)
On the other side of the aisle, below the cabinets, is another access door to the other well created in front of the rear wheel:
![[image]](http://s739.photobucket.com/user/dgorton/media/hatch2_zpsc45afd24.jpg.html)
I store water, sewage hoses, leveling blocks, etc in these spaces. .
Because of the east/west - north/south - weight distribution I have chosen to place the batteries as far forward as possible. I have also put the main water tank against the front, and the storage of additional water in disposable containers is on the opposite side from the batteries.
I think it may not be wise to place the batteries in the closet opposite the bath. My AGMs weigh around 75 pounds apiece. Over an area that is cantilevered I think it could cause some structural issues, not to mention weight distribution imbalance.
* This post was last edited 01/30/14 02:07pm by 67avion *
Battery and electrical area behind the seat.
![[image]](http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d92/garryk6/1966%20Avion%20Camper%20remodel/DSC06699-2.jpg)
starting of the electrical area...
![[image]](http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d92/garryk6/1966%20Avion%20Camper%20remodel/DSC06671.jpg)
Powermax Boondocker 45 amp Battery charger/maintainer.
![[image]](http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d92/garryk6/1966%20Avion%20Camper%20remodel/DSC06698.jpg)
This is what it looks like all sealed up, with an access door to the switch and fuses. When I have to get to the batteries, it is 4 Phillips screws to pull the seat back plywood out, and easy access to the wires and batteries.
![[image]](http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d92/garryk6/BA1D0CAB-8FD5-46B5-8634-27EF7381FBB7-30020-0000346CCC6AEDBE_zps3f493ee8.jpg)
Did you do a solar/electrical budget calculation? I'm impressed with the large size and capacity of your system. I've often seen truck camper electrical systems spec'd at 2 AGM Group 32 batteries and total of 110 watts of solar input. You are twice that and I'm interested in your thinking as I configure the interior of my rig.
Dick