Ballenxj
Formerly Southern Nevada, Idaho now
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Joined: 02/03/2003
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Griff in Fairbanks wrote:
At one point in my military career, I had the nickname "Gunny Griff" ... because people said I acted more like a USMC Gunnery Sergeant than a USAF Technical Sergeant.
This reminds me, R.I.P. Lee Ermey. ![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/frown.gif "frown")
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/r-lee-........-99-drill-sergeant-dies-at-74/ar-AAvXH5w
Your story reminds me of a neighbor lady that was constantly bugging me to move furniture for her and her husband because I had a pickup. The truck in question was my 1971 El Camino SS. Yeah, it was the small block one, but still...
I tried to explain nicely to her that it was not a moving van, and I even picked up one piece for them at the store. After that my standard answer was no...
Downsizing ">
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Eric Hysteric
Hildesheim
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Joined: 09/19/2017
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Hi Guys! Because my 4 barrel Carter Thermoquad leaks i bought a month ago a 1406 Edelbrock. Yesterday we wanted to replace the Thermoquad with the Edelbrock but we had some problems.
![[image]](https://img2.picload.org/image/dogolicr/img_20180417_210641921.jpg)
On the left side (in the direction of travel) is under the carburetor an EGR valve and no place for the linkage of the Edelbrock carburetor. My plan is to remove the EGR Valve and close the hole with a cap.
What is your opinion?
![[image]](https://img2.picload.org/image/dogolcow/img_20180417_222005449.jpg)
![[image]](https://img2.picload.org/image/dogolcla/img_20180417_224905745.jpg)
similiar to that:
![[image]](https://img2.picload.org/image/dogolcii/76318egrnpvc7-15-11002.jpg)
* This post was
edited 04/18/18 08:11am by Eric Hysteric *
'79 Dodge Sportsman 5.9 LA 360 TEC Campmate
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Eric Hysteric
Hildesheim
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The 2 another questiona are:
1. The carburaters have no fuel return line?
2. What is this? Do the Edelbrock need this vacuum part?
![[image]](https://img2.picload.org/image/dogolial/img_20180417_210121810.jpg)
![[image]](https://img1.picload.org/image/dogolior/img_20180417_214128484.jpg)
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StingrayL82
Nampa, Idaho
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Joined: 06/27/2017
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My opinion is keep the ThermoQuad and rebuild it, it’ll give you more reliability than that Edelbrock ever could and, yes, ditch the EGR. I made my own with 1/4” steel.
Fred
Retired Army Guy
2005 Monaco LaPalma 37PST
Workhorse W24 chassis
8.1L Vortec
Allison 2100 MH
Onyx Color Scheme
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Griff in Fairbanks
AK
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Joined: 04/21/2005
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Eric Hysteric wrote:Hi Guys! Because my 4 barrel Carter Thermoquad leaks i bought a month ago a 1406 Edelbrock. Yesterday we wanted to replace the Thermoquad with the Edelbrock but we had some problems.
On the left side (in the direction of travel) is under the carburetor an EGR valve and no place for the linkage of the Edelbrock carburetor. My plan is to remove the EGR Valve and close the hole with a cap.
What is your opinion?
Before deciding, check the EU regulations. In some places -- most notably California -- you can't register your motorhome if the EGR has been removed. So, does EU have vehicle emission inspections before registrations? (The inspections may have a different name.) If so, what does the inspection entail and how are they done?
Alaska had/has local option emissions inspections. Fairbanks did away their emissions inspection but I think Anchorage still does. The inspections started with a visual inspection to ensure all applicable OEM components were still in place and connected. Among other things, a missing EGR automatically meant a failed inspection. You then had a choice -- bring the vehicle back to OEM configuration or register it for "summer use only."
One option is a riser plate. There's arguments for riser plates, mostly because riser plates help keep the carburetor cooler. Downside is mostly clearance between air cleaner and hood/doghouse. The doghouse on vans and motorhomes traps heat, causing carburetors to run hotter. So, there's a strong reason for using a riser, especially a non-metallic one, on a van or motorhome.
(I've mentioned using small marine bilge blowers to reduce heat in the doghouses.)
Because you're going to a dual fuel system, clearance is definitely a concern for you if you choose a riser.
Contact Edelbrock tech support. They've almost definitely run into this before and know exactly how to solve the problem.
Personally, I'm inclined to remove the EGR, if it can be done legally.
1970 Explorer Class A on a 1969 Dodge M300 chassis with 318 cu. in. (split year)
1972 Executive Class A on a Dodge M375 chassis with 413 cu. in.
1973 Explorer Class A on a Dodge RM350 (R4) chassis with 318 engine & tranny from 1970 Explorer Class A
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Griff in Fairbanks
AK
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Eric Hysteric wrote:The 2 another questiona are:
1. The carburaters have no fuel return line?
No, not on almost all engines with carburetors. Fuel return lines are more common on fuel injected engines.
Eric Hysteric wrote:The 2 another questiona are:
2. What is this? Do the Edelbrock need this vacuum part?
Vacuum reservoir. Mostly used to dampen sudden changes in vacuum due rapid drastic changes in throttle position. Usually connected to the vacuum amplifier. Whether you need it or not depends how your engine is configured.
You'd need to talk to Mopar engineer, who thoroughly understands the older systems, for a definitive answer. (Even the most experienced Mopar mechanic probably wouldn't know for sure.)
The shadetree mechanic approach is to disconnect and plug the hose. Then see what happens in terms of engine performance, fuel consumption, and so forth. Disconnecting and plugging the hose won't hurt the engine. Doing so may make the engine run worse ... or may make it run better ... or there may be no discernible change.
Finally, carburetors create vacuum but don't use or rely on external vacuum systems. (There may be exceptions but they're few and far between.)
For nitpicker who may be inclined to comment: True, it's pistons that actually create vacuum. The carburetor (or throttle body) throttle plate merely modifies the amount of vacuum.
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Griff in Fairbanks
AK
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Griff in Fairbanks wrote:Eric Hysteric wrote:The 2 another questiona are:
1. The carburaters have no fuel return line?
No, not on almost all engines with carburetors. Fuel return lines are more common on fuel injected engines.
Eric Hysteric wrote:2. What is this? Do the Edelbrock need this vacuum part?
Vacuum reservoir. Mostly used to dampen sudden changes in vacuum due rapid drastic changes in throttle position. Usually connected to the vacuum amplifier. Whether you need it or not depends how your engine is configured.
You'd need to talk to Mopar engineer, who thoroughly understands the older systems, for a definitive answer. (Even the most experienced Mopar mechanic probably wouldn't know for sure.)
The shadetree mechanic approach is to disconnect and plug the hose. Then see what happens in terms of engine performance, fuel consumption, and so forth. Disconnecting and plugging the hose won't hurt the engine. Doing so may make the engine run worse ... or may make it run better ... or there may be no discernible change.
Finally, carburetors create vacuum but don't use or rely on external vacuum systems. (There may be exceptions but they're few and far between.)
For nitpicker who may be inclined to comment: True, it's pistons that actually create vacuum. The carburetor (or throttle body) throttle plate merely modifies the amount of vacuum.
Edit: Dammit, I meant to edit the previous post but accidentally hit the quote button. Sorry folks.
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Griff in Fairbanks
AK
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StingrayL82 wrote:My opinion is keep the ThermoQuad and rebuild it, it’ll give you more reliability than that Edelbrock ever could and, yes, ditch the EGR. I made my own with 1/4” steel.
Eric - this has been discussed extensively ... StingrayL82 is coming into the discussion late.
Ask ten people about carburetors. Three will say Carter AFB/Edelbrock is best. Three will say a ThermoQuad is the cat's meow. The remaining four will say chuck the four barrel and replace it with a two barrel.
Don't second guess yourself. You listened to various opinions and made your decision. You may find your decision doesn't work for you. However, in the vast majority of cases, you'll find your decision is right for you.
Lesson from decades of systems analysis and design: Only -- repeat only -- when you run into a cascade of steadily worsening problems is the only time you should back up and rethink your decisions.
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JoninFountain
Fountain
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Griff in Fairbanks wrote:Ballenxj wrote:Thanks Griff, that would explain the coaxing the engine to higher speeds until it smooth's out. I had a 340 do that to me once. (same basic block as a 360)
Once the chain gets loose, I've seen all kinds of erratic behavior as described. Once it's loose enough to jump, it can go any which way if you keep driving it.
Anyway, just my two cents.
You're welcome. IIRC, OEM sprockets were a composite material and OEM chain was an 'economy' version. Replaced with metal sprockets and premium chain. Lasted at least 150,000 miles that I know of. (Sold the van when USAF transferred me out of Alaska the first time so I don't know how long the timing chain actually lasted.)
Valve stems seals disintegrated around 100,000 miles, causing unusual oil consumption. Had heads rebuilt when I should have just replaced valve stem seals. (Rebuilding heads without addressing the cylinders transfers oil consumption and other problems from the valves to the piston rings ... now I hone and re-ring or -- preferably -- rebuild the short block if the heads need work.)
Note: Leeann has a big block and (IIRC) four barrel carburetor. JoninFountain has a small block with a two barrel carburetor. (Probably a Carter BBD.) Different engine families, different carburetors may mean different problems ... Leeann is good but I'd be cautious transferring her solutions to your engine.
Back to '77 B200 with LA small block and Carter BBD. Had to rebuild carburetor almost yearly, due to problems similar to JoninFountain's.
Turns out it was due to using 'economy' gas-line antifreeze with every fill-up. (Won't mention brand name but it was the inexpensive one that comes in yellow bottles.) The ethanol in the antifreeze was eating up the carburetor seals ... gasohol will do the same thing on carburetors that predate gasohol.
Forgot -- or didn't listen to -- an oldtimer who warned me about this, way back when I was in high school.
Modern carburetor rebuild kits have seals that resist ethanol/gasohol. Main problem is if you get a NOS rebuild kit that's been on the shelves for a while.
Going to check chain this weekend
78 Dodge Brougham Sportsman. MB400. 360 2bl.
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Griff in Fairbanks
AK
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JoninFountain wrote:Going to check chain this weekend
Do you have a timing light?
Disconnect and plug the vacuum advance hose. You don't want the vacuum advance changing the timing. Not plugging the hose creates a large vacuum leak that will affect engine performance.
Make sure the distributor is bolted down securely. (A loose distributor will vary the timing regardless of timing chain condition.)
Use the timing light per directions.
The timing mark will jump around a little ... plus or minus a few degrees ... this is due to differences between cylinders and distributor's internal centrifugal advance compensating for the differences.
If the timing mark jumps around a lot and doesn't stay relatively steady, you have worn timing. Stretched chain, worn sprockets, or both allowing the chain 'slop' around rather than the sprockets turning in unison.
If the timing mark is relatively steady but not on the mark, fix that first. Then, retry.
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