I doubt you can find a 5 lug 16" trailer wheel. Trailer wheel need to have a zero off set.
My old 1997 11200 lb 5th wheel trailer came with 5200 lb axles/6 lugs and 15" ST225/75-15 D Marathons. Sold wheels/tires to a guy with a lawn service trailer.
I bought four 16" grey steel modular trailer wheels (1997) from my local commercial trailer mfg. I thought I had wheel well clearance issues so went to a LT225/75-16 E at 2680 lbs. Next sets have been a bit taller in a LT215/85-16 E at 2680 lbs. Run all my LT E tires on rv and non rv trailers at max 80 psi.
The taller (32" dia) LT235/85-16 E at 3042 lbs capacity works better on heavier trailers with loaded 5.2k...6k axles.
LT tires that their mfg has recommended to me for my trailer use are;;
Cooper Discoverer HT-3
Bridgestone R-238 all steel ply carcass commercial grade
Michelin XPS Rib commercial grade all steel ply carcass
Goodyear Wrangler HT
BFG Commercial A/T 2
Firestone Transforce HT
Be sure and make your wheel well measurements first for proper clearance issues.
"good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment" ............ Will Rogers
'03 2500 QC Dodge/Cummins HO 3.73 6 speed manual Jacobs Westach
'97 Park Avanue 28' 5er 11200 two slides
LT should hold up well in all conditions.
Either way make sure the tires are load rated for the entire trailer GVWR.
2001 F150 SuperCrew
2006 Keystone Springdale 249FWBHLS
675w Solar pictures back up
2021 Ram Limited, 3500, Crew Cab, 1075FTPD of Torque!, Max Tow, Long bed, 4 x 4, Dually,
2006 40' Landmark Mt. Rushmore
time2roll wrote:
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK
1991 Slumberqueen WS100
eHoefler wrote:
I run LTs on all my trailers except the Fifth wheel, it has MTs on it.
I run LTs on all my trailers except the Fifth wheel, it has MTs on it.
Mud terrains?
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold
StirCrazy wrote:
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
time2roll wrote:
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
Except the OP is in the US, so the 15” GYE tires that are the right size and load range for his trailer are $160-170 and even 16” ones are 2 for $450….
2016 Jayco 28.5 RLTS
* This post was edited 06/27/23 11:18am by an administrator/moderator *
Also, do you check the tire pressure regularly?
Most blowouts are overloaded or under inflation.
A lot of people going to LTs increase the payload rating and keep a closer eye on pressure...then credit the fact they are LTs.
Tammy & Mike
Ford F250 V10
2021 Gray Wolf
Gemini Catamaran 34'
Full Time spliting time between boat and RV
And since the OP said his trailer is 8500lbs, there is less than 2000lbs load on each tire. If a 35% increase in tire capacity compared to the load isn’t enough, I’m not sure what’s being gained by up-sizing even more.
Not to mention that virtually any 15” trailer tire made today is actually within capacity for his camper, albeit with less reserve capacity.
There is a much larger selection on LT tires compared to ST tires. Better pricing.
valhalla360 wrote:
Have you weighed the trailer and checked against Payload rating of the tires?
Also, do you check the tire pressure regularly?
Most blowouts are overloaded or under inflation.
A lot of people going to LTs increase the payload rating and keep a closer eye on pressure...then credit the fact they are LTs.
I have not seen what you state of LT tire owners giving false credit to their sucess. I also have not seen any evidence of under inflation being a problem.Have you weighed the trailer and checked against Payload rating of the tires?
Also, do you check the tire pressure regularly?
Most blowouts are overloaded or under inflation.
A lot of people going to LTs increase the payload rating and keep a closer eye on pressure...then credit the fact they are LTs.
In fact every RV forum I have seen has a common theme, on ST tire care.
They check their tires at EVERY opportunity. I myself find this overkill...But then again, I switched to LTs in 2006.Ever since, I have been able to relax about my tires. Can you imagine have to check your automobile tires as much as RVers feel the need to for ST tires?
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
Huntindog
100% boondocking
2021 Grand Design Momentum 398M
2 bathrooms, no waiting
104 gal grey, 104 black,158 fresh
FullBodyPaint, 3,8Kaxles, DiscBrakes
17.5LRH commercial tires
1860watts solar,800 AH Battleborn batterys
2020 Silverado HighCountry CC DA 4X4 DRW
Most people who switch have no baseline to compare to. It's only after the blowouts that they start randomly trying things to improve the situation...like checking the pressure regularly (or adding a TPMS) or actually getting the RV weighed to make sure they aren't overloaded. Then they switch to LTs at the same time...low and behold, they are less likely to experience a blowout but never systematically tested to see what fixed the problem...then again blowouts are pretty rare to begin with so their changes may have zero impact.
Once you switch to LTs there is a bigger selection but that is mostly about tread patterns (and profitering). For a trailer, there isn't a lot of benefit to off road tires, so little reason to provide a wide variety of tread patterns in ST tires.
* This post was edited 06/28/23 08:28am by an administrator/moderator *
StirCrazy wrote:
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
Go ahead and beat me up on this... Not going to hurt my feelings or change my opinion. Are you sure you are talking about the exact tire? There is more than one line available.time2roll wrote:
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
Now try to actually add something to recommend for the OP
Grit dog wrote:
Except the OP is in the US, so the 15” GYE tires that are the right size and load range for his trailer are $160-170 and even 16” ones are 2 for $450….
StirCrazy wrote:
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
time2roll wrote:
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
GY Endurance or Carlisle Radial Trail HD are both quality speed rated ST tires.
.
I get a kick out of that every time I see it. Carlisle tires are one of the cheapest tires where I live and every tire shop steers you away from them as they have had to many issues with them, but down there everyone seems to love them.
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
Except the OP is in the US, so the 15” GYE tires that are the right size and load range for his trailer are $160-170 and even 16” ones are 2 for $450….
Oh, I imagine they are even cheaper than that down there. makes me wish I did more trips to the US so I could do more maintenance to the truck and trailer
![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/wink.gif "wink")
we get so hosed on pricing up here.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
valhalla360 wrote:
Govt has been mandating tire pressure systems on cars/trucks for around 15yrs and aftermarket systems for trailers are also very popular, so apparently, someone feels underinflation is an issue and constant monitoring is important.
Most people who switch have no baseline to compare to. It's only after the blowouts that they start randomly trying things to improve the situation...like checking the pressure regularly (or adding a TPMS) or actually getting the RV weighed to make sure they aren't overloaded. Then they switch to LTs at the same time...low and behold, they are less likely to experience a blowout but never systematically tested to see what fixed the problem...then again blowouts are pretty rare to begin with so their changes may have zero impact.
Once you switch to LTs there is a bigger selection but that is mostly about tread patterns (and profitering). For a trailer, there isn't a lot of benefit to off road tires, so little reason to provide a wide variety of tread patterns in ST tires.
Huntindog wrote:
In fact every RV forum I have seen has a common theme, on ST tire care.
They check their tires at EVERY opportunity. I myself find this overkill...But then again, I switched to LTs in 2006.Ever since, I have been able to relax about my tires. Can you imagine have to check your automobile tires as much as RVers feel the need to for ST tires?
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
valhalla360 wrote:
Have you weighed the trailer and checked against Payload rating of the tires?
Also, do you check the tire pressure regularly?
Most blowouts are overloaded or under inflation.
A lot of people going to LTs increase the payload rating and keep a closer eye on pressure...then credit the fact they are LTs.
I have not seen what you state of LT tire owners giving false credit to their sucess. I also have not seen any evidence of under inflation being a problem.Have you weighed the trailer and checked against Payload rating of the tires?
Also, do you check the tire pressure regularly?
Most blowouts are overloaded or under inflation.
A lot of people going to LTs increase the payload rating and keep a closer eye on pressure...then credit the fact they are LTs.
In fact every RV forum I have seen has a common theme, on ST tire care.
They check their tires at EVERY opportunity. I myself find this overkill...But then again, I switched to LTs in 2006.Ever since, I have been able to relax about my tires. Can you imagine have to check your automobile tires as much as RVers feel the need to for ST tires?
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
Govt has been mandating tire pressure systems on cars/trucks for around 15yrs and aftermarket systems for trailers are also very popular, so apparently, someone feels underinflation is an issue and constant monitoring is important.
Most people who switch have no baseline to compare to. It's only after the blowouts that they start randomly trying things to improve the situation...like checking the pressure regularly (or adding a TPMS) or actually getting the RV weighed to make sure they aren't overloaded. Then they switch to LTs at the same time...low and behold, they are less likely to experience a blowout but never systematically tested to see what fixed the problem...then again blowouts are pretty rare to begin with so their changes may have zero impact.
Once you switch to LTs there is a bigger selection but that is mostly about tread patterns (and profitering). For a trailer, there isn't a lot of benefit to off road tires, so little reason to provide a wide variety of tread patterns in ST tires.
I once drank the ST tire koolaid.
My first TT was purchased in 1992. Tire failures started right away.I believed the ST dribble I read about here on the forum. In fact I often debated on this very forum spouting off all of the supposed reasons a ST tire must be used. Many sets of STs, and load range/size increases later, and on TT #2 I threw in the towel on STs. That was in 2006. I am sometimes a slow learner, but I DO learn.
My tires have been trouble free ever since.
Why do you think LT tires have such higher govt. testing standards? Why does it state on the sidewall of an ST, "Not for automobile use? Why is there no such limitation for LT tires? It is perfectly legal to use an LT on a trailer, but ILLEGAL to use an ST on an automobile.
The reason is that people ride in autos, so the tires are mandated to be better.
* This post was edited 06/28/23 08:54am by Huntindog *
2stonesthrow wrote:
TIre recommendations? We are towing 8500# travel trailer. We’ve had numerous blowouts with China bombs over the years, partly due to Texas heat and high speeds. We are over the blow outs and need something that will hold. We currently have 15” but looking to go to 16” LT that can handle higher speeds of 75mph. What has worked for you with the higher speeds? Tia!
TIre recommendations? We are towing 8500# travel trailer. We’ve had numerous blowouts with China bombs over the years, partly due to Texas heat and high speeds. We are over the blow outs and need something that will hold. We currently have 15” but looking to go to 16” LT that can handle higher speeds of 75mph. What has worked for you with the higher speeds? Tia!
Since this gets soo off topic, back to your original question. Virtually any load range E tire that fits the rim and fits under the trailer is just fine. You got the rims yet?
StirCrazy wrote:
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
StirCrazy wrote:
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
As for endurance, I am sure they are great but at almost 450.00/tire they are not one I'll ever buy...
Those must be the platinum edition Endurance tires. I paid about $130/tire installed on sale for mine. I just got the regular rubber ones though. E rated for weight, 87 mph speed rating.
Not a single problem with them.
2015 Ram CTD
2015 Jayco 29QBS
Huntindog wrote:
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
StirCrazy wrote:
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
And here is the part you missed: ST tires are rated for about 20% more load than LT tires. The net effect is the tires are tested at the same load - more or less.
So when installed on a trailer, the load is the same regardless of which type of tire you put on.
********************************************************************
CapriRacer
Visit my web site: www.BarrysTireTech.com
Commercial grade all steel carcass 16" ST load G tires like the Sailun S637 are a class way above a poly carcass 16" ST load C/D/E.
The ST may have extra load capacity over the LT tire but it still doesn't have to pass the higher speed (mph) ratings of the LT tire.
Thats big for a lay person if miles (30k-50k) of trouble free service and reliability are expected from tires on any trailer.
CapriRacer wrote:
And here is the part you missed: ST tires are rated for about 20% more load than LT tires. The net effect is the tires are tested at the same load - more or less.
So when installed on a trailer, the load is the same regardless of which type of tire you put on.
I did not miss that.Huntindog wrote:
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
StirCrazy wrote:
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
And here is the part you missed: ST tires are rated for about 20% more load than LT tires. The net effect is the tires are tested at the same load - more or less.
So when installed on a trailer, the load is the same regardless of which type of tire you put on.
Size for size STs do come with a higher load rating. But both types are tested to their load rating.... I think the 20% figure is on the high end though. I do not remember it being that much on the tires I had. So when making the swap. one has to be sure the tire has the load rating needed. It's not that hard to do. and if you want a reliable tire you can do it. Imagine TT tires that one doesn't have to check on at every stop. Have a rabbi bless them, rub baby oil on them, sacrifice a chicken etc. just to have them fail anyways. It can be done.One can have TT tires every bit as reliable as automobile tires. Just get over the ST tire love fest... They will not love you back
Huntindog wrote:
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
StirCrazy wrote:
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
but what you are missing is if a ST tire is rated for a higher speed, then it had to be tested at that speed. I know some of the tests are more stringent for a LT tire as they carry people, where as a ST tire carries well nothing that can't be replaced so if you drive over the tested design speed that's on you. The ones I just put on my 5th are rated up to 75MPH so they would have to be tested at that to get that rating. do I ever drive that fast, no. I just finished a 1000 mile round trip and locked the speed control in at 60mph.
the biggest reason for blowouts with ST tires is User error, I know we hate to hear that stuff is our own fault or road hazards. 9 out of 10 are people not checking pressure, not inspecting their tires, driving too fast on lower rated tires, buying the cheapest of cheap tires to save a buck, or just plain old road hazards. Potholes, for example, can put a week spot in the tire a year later when you are traveling on a hot day at close to the capacity in speed or weight and all of a sudden it blows. You can't explain it as the damage happened last season and just held till now.
Just like LT tires you don't go out and look for the absolute cheapest one that isn't rated for your truck when loaded or the speed you drive at, but why do we do that with our RV's. Yes, the manufacturer will put the cheapest ones they can get that are legal for the weight and they don't care about speed as the paperwork for the tires says 50mpg and that's on you if you drive it faster. the tires that came on my rv were capable of hauling the weight and close to the speed I drive but not quite. I had one blowout after 6 years of use. my old trailer I never had a blow out till 10 years of use (yes those tires should have been changed but I didn't know much about inspecting them at that point in time.) On my 5th wheel I found a broken bead and changed that one out two years ago, last year I had a blow out, then for this year I changed all 4 out so they were matching, and I found one of the other older ones had tread separation starting. the factory tires had a 2-2-1 belt design and used nylon and polyester as well as steel belts. My new ones are rated to 75mph, use a 2-2-2 construction and are all steel construction. so I got these ones figuring I would kick the major upgrade down the road another 5 or 6 years as to move to the sailun I need new rims also. These ones are rated at 1300 lbs higher than the weight that will be on them so there is buffer on the speed and the capacity.
LT or ST is a personal choice and people will argue about it all day, throwing facts to skew the discussion one way or another to suit them selves. in the end if you have cheap tires and one blows upgrade to a better tire that suits how you drive and the weight you have on them. if you drive 80mph then ya probably no ST tire is rated over 75mph so you need to look at LT tires. if you drive 70 then there are options in both.
JIMNLIN wrote:
One thing we learn when towing trailers for a living is load C/D/E ST tires simply will not stand up to this type of daily work for thousands of miles like a good recommended (tire mfg recommendations) LT tire.
Commercial grade all steel carcass 16" ST load G tires like the Sailun S637 are a class way above a poly carcass 16" ST load C/D/E.
The ST may have extra load capacity over the LT tire but it still doesn't have to pass the higher speed (mph) ratings of the LT tire.
Thats big for a lay person if miles (30k-50k) of trouble free service and reliability are expected from tires on any trailer.
One thing we learn when towing trailers for a living is load C/D/E ST tires simply will not stand up to this type of daily work for thousands of miles like a good recommended (tire mfg recommendations) LT tire.
Commercial grade all steel carcass 16" ST load G tires like the Sailun S637 are a class way above a poly carcass 16" ST load C/D/E.
The ST may have extra load capacity over the LT tire but it still doesn't have to pass the higher speed (mph) ratings of the LT tire.
Thats big for a lay person if miles (30k-50k) of trouble free service and reliability are expected from tires on any trailer.
you can get load grade e in all steel also, that's what I put on the 5th this year while I save up for the new rims I need for the sailun
StirCrazy wrote:
but what you are missing is if a ST tire is rated for a higher speed, then it had to be tested at that speed. I know some of the tests are more stringent for a LT tire as they carry people, where as a ST tire carries well nothing that can't be replaced so if you drive over the tested design speed that's on you. The ones I just put on my 5th are rated up to 75MPH so they would have to be tested at that to get that rating. do I ever drive that fast, no. I just finished a 1000 mile round trip and locked the speed control in at 60mph.
the biggest reason for blowouts with ST tires is User error, I know we hate to hear that stuff is our own fault or road hazards. 9 out of 10 are people not checking pressure, not inspecting their tires, driving too fast on lower rated tires, buying the cheapest of cheap tires to save a buck, or just plain old road hazards. Potholes, for example, can put a week spot in the tire a year later when you are traveling on a hot day at close to the capacity in speed or weight and all of a sudden it blows. You can't explain it as the damage happened last season and just held till now.
Just like LT tires you don't go out and look for the absolute cheapest one that isn't rated for your truck when loaded or the speed you drive at, but why do we do that with our RV's. Yes, the manufacturer will put the cheapest ones they can get that are legal for the weight and they don't care about speed as the paperwork for the tires says 50mpg and that's on you if you drive it faster. the tires that came on my rv were capable of hauling the weight and close to the speed I drive but not quite. I had one blowout after 6 years of use. my old trailer I never had a blow out till 10 years of use (yes those tires should have been changed but I didn't know much about inspecting them at that point in time.) On my 5th wheel I found a broken bead and changed that one out two years ago, last year I had a blow out, then for this year I changed all 4 out so they were matching, and I found one of the other older ones had tread separation starting. the factory tires had a 2-2-1 belt design and used nylon and polyester as well as steel belts. My new ones are rated to 75mph, use a 2-2-2 construction and are all steel construction. so I got these ones figuring I would kick the major upgrade down the road another 5 or 6 years as to move to the sailun I need new rims also. These ones are rated at 1300 lbs higher than the weight that will be on them so there is buffer on the speed and the capacity.
LT or ST is a personal choice and people will argue about it all day, throwing facts to skew the discussion one way or another to suit them selves. in the end if you have cheap tires and one blows upgrade to a better tire that suits how you drive and the weight you have on them. if you drive 80mph then ya probably no ST tire is rated over 75mph so you need to look at LT tires. if you drive 70 then there are options in both.
Are you a part time comedian?Huntindog wrote:
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
StirCrazy wrote:
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
Huntindog wrote:
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
The fact is that the govt. LT tire testing standards are much more demanding than for ST tires. That being a FACT, it is not hard to understand why STs fail so often.
On another note: LT tire choices in the 16" rim size are many. In fact most if not all manufacturers offer Good, Better, Best models to choose from. Such selection just isn't availible in ST tires. There is a choice of ONE from each manufacturer...So if one wishes to buy a premium ST tire,,,There are none availible....But as an observation of the testing standards, the cheapest LT tire is tested to higher standards than any ST tire.
didn't we have a thread a while ago where we found that the testing standard for both tires is virtually the same, but the LT does one test to a higher speed (partially loaded I believe it was at 60PSI) where the ST does a higher max load test? doesn't sound like it is much more demanding, or a fact.
This is the part you missed:But now the endurance testing diverges significantly.
The ST tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 50 mph. After that, the ST test is over.
The LT tire is tested at this pressure, time and load profile at 75 mph. This is a 50% increase over the ST and will induce significant additional load and heating on the tire during testing. After that, the LT test is not complete. Next a “Low Inflation Pressure Performance” test is performed for the LT tire only. The tire pressure is decreased to 46 psi and the tire is immediately run for an additional 2 hours at 75 mph and 100% of rated load.
Thus, the LT tire endurance test is drastically more intense than the ST endurance test.
but what you are missing is if a ST tire is rated for a higher speed, then it had to be tested at that speed. I know some of the tests are more stringent for a LT tire as they carry people, where as a ST tire carries well nothing that can't be replaced so if you drive over the tested design speed that's on you. The ones I just put on my 5th are rated up to 75MPH so they would have to be tested at that to get that rating. do I ever drive that fast, no. I just finished a 1000 mile round trip and locked the speed control in at 60mph.
the biggest reason for blowouts with ST tires is User error, I know we hate to hear that stuff is our own fault or road hazards. 9 out of 10 are people not checking pressure, not inspecting their tires, driving too fast on lower rated tires, buying the cheapest of cheap tires to save a buck, or just plain old road hazards. Potholes, for example, can put a week spot in the tire a year later when you are traveling on a hot day at close to the capacity in speed or weight and all of a sudden it blows. You can't explain it as the damage happened last season and just held till now.
Just like LT tires you don't go out and look for the absolute cheapest one that isn't rated for your truck when loaded or the speed you drive at, but why do we do that with our RV's. Yes, the manufacturer will put the cheapest ones they can get that are legal for the weight and they don't care about speed as the paperwork for the tires says 50mpg and that's on you if you drive it faster. the tires that came on my rv were capable of hauling the weight and close to the speed I drive but not quite. I had one blowout after 6 years of use. my old trailer I never had a blow out till 10 years of use (yes those tires should have been changed but I didn't know much about inspecting them at that point in time.) On my 5th wheel I found a broken bead and changed that one out two years ago, last year I had a blow out, then for this year I changed all 4 out so they were matching, and I found one of the other older ones had tread separation starting. the factory tires had a 2-2-1 belt design and used nylon and polyester as well as steel belts. My new ones are rated to 75mph, use a 2-2-2 construction and are all steel construction. so I got these ones figuring I would kick the major upgrade down the road another 5 or 6 years as to move to the sailun I need new rims also. These ones are rated at 1300 lbs higher than the weight that will be on them so there is buffer on the speed and the capacity.
LT or ST is a personal choice and people will argue about it all day, throwing facts to skew the discussion one way or another to suit them selves. in the end if you have cheap tires and one blows upgrade to a better tire that suits how you drive and the weight you have on them. if you drive 80mph then ya probably no ST tire is rated over 75mph so you need to look at LT tires. if you drive 70 then there are options in both.
In an attempt to persuade others on STs superiority, you list 4 failures. You also state that LTs are tested to more stringent standards, because they carry people.
This is hilarious
To be fair, you’re kinda the same way….jumping straight into the must have LTs, many times without regard for the actual camper and weight that the person is asking abooot.
Grit dog wrote:
^Meh…
To be fair, you’re kinda the same way….jumping straight into the must have LTs, many times without regard for the actual camper and weight that the person is asking abooot.
You should notice I am the one that posted the facts abooot govt. tire test standards. I am serious abooot my dismal record with STs. And my perfect record with LTs.My tire usage is admittadly HARD on tires. As a hardcore boondocker my trips always include Off pavement miles, in Arizona heat...A lot of it not good roads. Probably my fault for expecting those poor ST tires to hang in there with the LT tires on my truck. ^Meh…
To be fair, you’re kinda the same way….jumping straight into the must have LTs, many times without regard for the actual camper and weight that the person is asking abooot.
I am upfront and honest abooooot modifications that may need to be made to enable such a swap. I am also honest abooot the need to choose a tire with the load rating needed.
One catstrophic failure can easily be more than the cost to switch tires.
Should I be quiet abooot my real life experiences? Or tell them so people can judge for themselves? If that amuses you, then I am OK with that.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
But what you’re doing is the equivalent of any time someone asks if a mid size suv is good for a popup, saying get a Duramax.
Just like self proclaiming that you’re VERY hard on tires and based on your experiences 20-30 years ago that the same still applies or applies to folks who are not doing extreme boondocking or whatever you called it with 30-40’ long campers.
You’ve done the same in other discussions where your recommendation is wholly impractical or impossible (like any trailer with 5 lug axles).
In this case the OP said they want to upgrade to 16s but then ghosted the thread. Whether they can or not we will never know probably.
But to refuse to believe that a good ST tire with well over 30% headroom in capacity will hold up is not being helpful. It’s just being stodgy.
Thats right, those tires made it 50 miles.
It was summertime and hot as hell. DW was waving passing traffic over as I layed on the trucks floor mats to keep from burning myself on the asphalt. After getting back on the road, DW was concerned. With all the money we been had spending on set after set of upgrading ST tires, and still having failures, she asked me what else could we do short of selling the TT. We had three of our Brittanys qualified to compete in the AKC Brittany Gundog National Championships In Iona Michigan, about a 5000 mile round trip coming up. and needed to have reliable tires to make the trip. I told her that a few people here had said that LTs were better. She said "Do it" I told her it would be expensive. We would need another set of 5 new rims in 16",new 6 lug drums/bearings, some suspension work to obtain clearance and 5 new Michelin XPS RIBS.
she said "Do it. I do not want to see you laying under the TT on hot asphalt with traffic whizzing by you again" I got the swap done for around 1500.00 2006 dollars. And never had a tire issue since.
So in my experience, one can put reliable LT tires on most any TT, if one wants to badly enough.
* This post was last edited 07/07/23 04:28pm by an administrator/moderator *
CapriRacer wrote:
As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
I am on a few forums. One thing has not changed over my 30+ years of towing RVs.As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
Huntindog wrote:
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
CapriRacer wrote:
As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
I am on a few forums. One thing has not changed over my 30+ years of towing RVs.As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
That's because 95+% of folks on forums know as much about towing and trailer tires as they do when it comes to determining what end is the business end of a screwdriver.
My tire BLEW OUT LOL. That happened sometime after Joe Blowout took a long trip and stopped to pee every 60 miles by pulling off and riding down debris filled road shoulders to make the pee stop, maybe clipping a curb a few times too.
How many times since RV forums have been in existence have you seen someone admit they had a tire failure of some sort and it was their fault. I don't think I've ever seen one.
I suppose I have an equal distaste for those as he does for trailer tires in general.
Although of the half dozen or so “blowouts” I know for sure 3 of them were due to low pressure and one of them, the 3rd one of the day lol and only went like 70 miles round trip to the lake, was a box of nails in the road pulling back into our subdivision after 3 fun filled hours of tire swapping at the lake and going to Walmart on a Sat afternoon for anything that would fit on the rims.
The other common theme was all of the suspect Marathons had spent about 4 years sitting out in the Phx/Vegas sun basically year round.
The low pressure issues was the guy who was towing our new boat up to us and “forgot” to fill the tires. When I brought him a spare 100miles from our house after 400miles on the road, 1 was at zero and in pieces and the other three were at 30-35psi on a hot sunny day.
So, I never bought Marathons, I haven’t run sun baked tires and I continue to make sure they are not running low on air.
Still, the recommendation to do whatever necessary even if impractical to get LT tires on basically any trailer in any conditions is just over the top.
StonedPanther wrote:
That's because 95+% of folks on forums know as much about towing and trailer tires as they do when it comes to determining what end is the business end of a screwdriver.
My tire BLEW OUT LOL. That happened sometime after Joe Blowout took a long trip and stopped to pee every 60 miles by pulling off and riding down debris filled road shoulders to make the pee stop, maybe clipping a curb a few times too.
How many times since RV forums have been in existence have you seen someone admit they had a tire failure of some sort and it was their fault. I don't think I've ever seen one.
Huntindog wrote:
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
CapriRacer wrote:
As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
I am on a few forums. One thing has not changed over my 30+ years of towing RVs.As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
That's because 95+% of folks on forums know as much about towing and trailer tires as they do when it comes to determining what end is the business end of a screwdriver.
My tire BLEW OUT LOL. That happened sometime after Joe Blowout took a long trip and stopped to pee every 60 miles by pulling off and riding down debris filled road shoulders to make the pee stop, maybe clipping a curb a few times too.
How many times since RV forums have been in existence have you seen someone admit they had a tire failure of some sort and it was their fault. I don't think I've ever seen one.
I did haha, my blowout last summer was from driving through a construction zone on the highway and having to be on the shoulder so I picked up something off the road, and the one on my old trailer with 9 year old tires was from hitting a pothole at a train track at 50mph which I totally should have seen. almost no such thing as a spontaneous failure, there's always some reason. with our massive dump trucks at the mine, we get the same thing. rolling over a rock the size of a fist puts stress on cords, and it doesn't blow then but as you roll over more rocks over the next few months the spot gets weaker and weaker and later down the road it lets lose.
Grit dog wrote:
What’s coincidental is I can relate to Huntindog and ST tires popping like popcorn in Phoenix in the summer and a few years later in Colorado. There was one constant among all of them. They were the early-mid 2000s GY Marathins.
I suppose I have an equal distaste for those as he does for trailer tires in general.
Although of the half dozen or so “blowouts” I know for sure 3 of them were due to low pressure and one of them, the 3rd one of the day lol and only went like 70 miles round trip to the lake, was a box of nails in the road pulling back into our subdivision after 3 fun filled hours of tire swapping at the lake and going to Walmart on a Sat afternoon for anything that would fit on the rims.
The other common theme was all of the suspect Marathons had spent about 4 years sitting out in the Phx/Vegas sun basically year round.
The low pressure issues was the guy who was towing our new boat up to us and “forgot” to fill the tires. When I brought him a spare 100miles from our house after 400miles on the road, 1 was at zero and in pieces and the other three were at 30-35psi on a hot sunny day.
So, I never bought Marathons, I haven’t run sun baked tires and I continue to make sure they are not running low on air.
Still, the recommendation to do whatever necessary even if impractical to get LT tires on basically any trailer in any conditions is just over the top.
I had two sets of Marathons. The OE. LRC in which all 4 had slipped belts. And that last set of 15" LRE In between I had too many sets to remember them all. I even tried a set of Bias ply STs. None of them made it to their second birthday At some point one needs to find a solution, or give up on towable RVs. I am not a quitter. I found a solution that works. It may not be easy or cheap.....But it would have been a LOT cheaper had I not wasted all that money on STs.What’s coincidental is I can relate to Huntindog and ST tires popping like popcorn in Phoenix in the summer and a few years later in Colorado. There was one constant among all of them. They were the early-mid 2000s GY Marathins.
I suppose I have an equal distaste for those as he does for trailer tires in general.
Although of the half dozen or so “blowouts” I know for sure 3 of them were due to low pressure and one of them, the 3rd one of the day lol and only went like 70 miles round trip to the lake, was a box of nails in the road pulling back into our subdivision after 3 fun filled hours of tire swapping at the lake and going to Walmart on a Sat afternoon for anything that would fit on the rims.
The other common theme was all of the suspect Marathons had spent about 4 years sitting out in the Phx/Vegas sun basically year round.
The low pressure issues was the guy who was towing our new boat up to us and “forgot” to fill the tires. When I brought him a spare 100miles from our house after 400miles on the road, 1 was at zero and in pieces and the other three were at 30-35psi on a hot sunny day.
So, I never bought Marathons, I haven’t run sun baked tires and I continue to make sure they are not running low on air.
Still, the recommendation to do whatever necessary even if impractical to get LT tires on basically any trailer in any conditions is just over the top.
When I bought my 2010 Sabre, I was praying it's STs would make it home. Thankfully they did. I then swapped the LTs from my Wilderness to the Sabre. The guy I sold the Wilderness to was thrilled that he got new tires/rims. I was glad to be rid of them. I would rather have used LTs than new STs
StonedPanther wrote:
That's because 95+% of folks on forums know as much about towing and trailer tires as they do when it comes to determining what end is the business end of a screwdriver.
My tire BLEW OUT LOL. That happened sometime after Joe Blowout took a long trip and stopped to pee every 60 miles by pulling off and riding down debris filled road shoulders to make the pee stop, maybe clipping a curb a few times too.
How many times since RV forums have been in existence have you seen someone admit they had a tire failure of some sort and it was their fault. I don't think I've ever seen one.
Huntindog wrote:
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
CapriRacer wrote:
As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
I am on a few forums. One thing has not changed over my 30+ years of towing RVs.As a tire engineer, I find these discussions very interesting. It's hard to sort out the experiences some had recently against someone who remembers the way it used to be long ago.
There was a time where LT tires didn't perform very well - which is why the government tests were changed. What we don't have is reliable information about current tires. This is partially because things have improved to the point where actual failures are fairly rare.
Tire problems were, and still are easily the most common topic
That's because 95+% of folks on forums know as much about towing and trailer tires as they do when it comes to determining what end is the business end of a screwdriver.
My tire BLEW OUT LOL. That happened sometime after Joe Blowout took a long trip and stopped to pee every 60 miles by pulling off and riding down debris filled road shoulders to make the pee stop, maybe clipping a curb a few times too.
How many times since RV forums have been in existence have you seen someone admit they had a tire failure of some sort and it was their fault. I don't think I've ever seen one.
We’ve had travel trailers and 5th wheels since 1994. I maintain proper pressures in my truck and trailer tires. The trucks go down the same highways at the same speeds the trailers go behind us. Usually 65~mph. I’ve never lost a truck tire even at up to seven years old and one set over 70k miles. While I’ve never had a blowout on a trailer tire, I’ve had several ST tires with tread starting to separate and I felt the vibration. One our last 340 mile trip, I had two 18 month old ST tires begin to separate causing bloated tires. They had just over 700 miles on them. These were Tire Kingdom National brand 225/75 R15E ST’s. I’ve had the best luck with Goodyear ST’s even during the Marathon years. I got seven years out of a set of Carlisle radial E’s way back when they were called junk. I might try a set of Goodyear Endurance ST’s on my 8500~lb TT. For $500~ more, I can upgrade to a set of 5 Goodyear Wrangler Workhorse LT225/75 r16’s on new 16” rims and forget about trailer tire worries. If it were negligence as you say, the tow vehicles of these negligent owners would be suffering the same tire troubles.
2020 F250 STX CC SB 7.3L 10spd 3.55 4x4
2010 F250 XLT CC SB 5.4L 5spdTS 3.73
ex '95 Cummins,'98 12v Cummins,'01.5 Cummins,'03 Cummins; '05 Hemi
2017 Jayco 28RLS TT 32.5'
Where are the Endurance made?
Thoughts on either tire?
2020 Keystone Cougar 26RBS "Pressure Relief 4"
2017 Silverado LTZ 6.2 4x4
MM2 USN 1970-75
USS Canisteo AO-99
USS Miller DE-1091
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Knowledge is good". Emil Faber
* This post was edited 07/22/23 08:08am by an administrator/moderator *
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![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53063717708_4e041ecc9a_q.jpg)
Mr. C wrote:
Zero damage. The tire held together pretty well...
![[image]](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53063617705_90b3fcd498_q.jpg[/img<br>
<br>
[img]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53063717708_4e041ecc9a_q.jpg)
]Good, you dodged a bullet. How did you catch it? TPMS?Zero damage. The tire held together pretty well...
So another tire getting ready to blow... Typical of ST junk.
QC always suspect where liability doesn’t amount to much.
A travel trailer isn’t a construction materials trailer gets dragged around a metro. A failure isn’t the problem a TT experiences with a blowout. Not in damage nor time spent on the highway shoulder.
Non-ST is an easy choice thereby.
Matching load requirements to tire choice remains for research.
I used Yokohama RY-215 last time and may again.
Start with a scale ticket after loaded for camping, full fresh water + propane.
Use reality over guesstimates.
.
2004 555 CTD QC LB NV-5600
1990 35’ Silver Streak
Falken AT3 may be one of them.
Slowmover, above, while good intentions, only recommended a tire that doesn’t exist anymore.
Every time we go out we have people blow past us at 75 mph plus and from the cheap trailer, I am sure they are running the original cheap Chines tires with a 65 mph speed rating.
Ken
Amateur Radio Operator.
2023 Cougar 22MLS, toted with a 2022, F150, 3.5L EcoBoost, Crewcab, Max Tow, FORMER Full Time RVer. Travel with a standard schnauzer and a Timneh African Gray parrot
Mr. C wrote:
First blowout ever, today. 3+ yr old/2500mi 225/75R15 Trailer King. I'll be sticking with ST. So I guess my best choices are GY Endurance or Maxxis M8008, which I had on a previous trailer.
Where are the Endurance made?
Thoughts on either tire?
First blowout ever, today. 3+ yr old/2500mi 225/75R15 Trailer King. I'll be sticking with ST. So I guess my best choices are GY Endurance or Maxxis M8008, which I had on a previous trailer.
Where are the Endurance made?
Thoughts on either tire?
I believe endurance are made in U.S.
I've run Maxxis and endurance. I'll give the nod to Endurance
a) they carry a real speed rating w/o derating load. IIRC 85mph (M?) which means it must be tested per M ratings which is more stringent than the ST 65 rating
b) At least the set I had didn't need much weigh to balance, way less than any of the previous 4 sets of Maxxis I've run
c) cost is on par with Maxxis, In fact when I bought mine a few years ago, at discount tire it was actually a few dollars less.
But then previously I ran 4 sets of Maxxis on my two trailers, around 125K total miles with no tire failures. Did pick up nails twice, but the trailer TPMS caught that and likely avoided a blowout.
2011 Keystone Outback 295RE
2004 14' bikehauler with full living quarters
2015.5 Denali 4x4 CC/SB Duramax/Allison
2004.5 Silverado 4x4 CC/SB Duramax/Allison passed on to our Son!
Now if you have 16" rims, no problem, lots of LRE tires to choose from
* This post was edited 09/02/23 06:34pm by an administrator/moderator *
But as I mentioned above, there are a couple 15” LRE tires out there. May have to upsize to a 235.
However there is a virtual plethora of good heavy duty 15” ST tires available. AND not horribly expensive to boot. And universally available.
No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel. Literally or figuratively.
shelbyfv wrote:
My tires are also 225/75R15. A scan of Discount Tire site doesn't give me any LT options. Guess that saves me from having to decide....
My tires are also 225/75R15. A scan of Discount Tire site doesn't give me any LT options. Guess that saves me from having to decide....
Lots of folks decide to ditch the 15" wheels and put on a set of 16" wheels for a better tire selection. Make sure you have sufficient clearance for any larger or taller tires/wheels.
Ken
Better service record than Maxxis ST8008 with over 30 tire complaints on this and IRv2 rv websites.
My 1997 11200 lb 5th wheel/5200 lb tandem axles, came with new Marathon ST225/75-15 D. At that time I wouldn't use a ST tire so I upgraded to 16" wheels and LT225/75-16 E BFG Commercial T/A/other recommended LT brands. I'm running in the 51k-54k mile range/7-8 years per set with no issues.
Deleted " a year range"...jim"
* This post was last edited 09/02/23 06:35pm by an administrator/moderator *
Grit dog wrote:
^Bingo. Something lost on the “LT tires only” crowd.
But as I mentioned above, there are a couple 15” LRE tires out there. May have to upsize to a 235.
However there is a virtual plethora of good heavy duty 15” ST tires available. AND not horribly expensive to boot. And universally available.
No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel. Literally or figuratively.
Nothing is "lost"^Bingo. Something lost on the “LT tires only” crowd.
But as I mentioned above, there are a couple 15” LRE tires out there. May have to upsize to a 235.
However there is a virtual plethora of good heavy duty 15” ST tires available. AND not horribly expensive to boot. And universally available.
No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel. Literally or figuratively.
Changing rim sizes sizes is commonly done in order to run better tires.
For some reason, the anti LT tire crowd insists that one MUST use the factory sizes.
How do you like the 37"s on your TV?
How do I like the 37s? Umm they’re fine, just like any other tires? What do you mean?
* This post was edited 09/02/23 06:35pm by an administrator/moderator *
You did not take your own advice when changing the tires on your truck to something different than stock.....There was no need to "reinvent the wheel" as you said.
Even though going to larger tires and a lift on a TV makes it LESS capable as a TV, you still chose to do it.
OTOH. There are no downsides to going to 16"rims on a trailer other than up front cost. A single blowout can make that cost look cheap.
It's a free country, one can do whatever they want with their money...I am just pointing out the inconsistencies of your logic.
* This post was edited 09/02/23 06:36pm by an administrator/moderator *
Huntindog wrote:
There are no downsides to going to 16"rims on a trailer other than up front cost. A single blowout can make that cost look cheap.
It's a free country, one can do whatever they want with their money...I am just pointing out the inconsistencies of your logic.
There are no downsides to going to 16"rims on a trailer other than up front cost. A single blowout can make that cost look cheap.
It's a free country, one can do whatever they want with their money...I am just pointing out the inconsistencies of your logic.
Well, there could be for some rv's a larger rim side usually = a larger tire (as in taller) which reduces clearance between the top of the tire and the rv floor. So, if it fails you can cause more damage, or it could even rub on bigger bumps. So, to prevent this you have to look at smaller size 16" rubber to keep a close to stock height which normally means lower carrying capacity not defeating the purpose you went to a taller tire for but rather limiting the payback for the expense.
Now some people put a lift on their rv when they go to a bigger rim, this is the best way to do it but still not cheap. and except to tell people about it or wanting extra clearance for off roading there is no reason for it, buy a quality st tire and call it done.
They certainly are tested to lower standards and thats a fact. Not opinion. Another fun fact:It is illegal to put ST tires on automobiles, But perfectly legal to put LTs on trailers.There are reasons for this.(hint; lower testing standards for STs). Take a look at all the choices available for 16" LT tires. Most if not all brands have several price points and quality points to choose from. IE: Good, Better,Best. In ST tires each brand has ONE offering.
* This post was edited 09/02/23 06:37pm by an administrator/moderator *
here is a good explanation of the differences and why you shouldn't run st on a car and why you shouldnt run lt on trailer
"Trailer Tire requirements differ greatly from automotive tires. Automotive tires must maintain traction during all driving conditions: pulling, stopping, turning, or swerving. Because of this they must have more flexible sidewalls to maintain tread to road contact. Since trailers have no driving torque applied to their axles, the only time trailer tires must have traction is during the application of trailer brakes.
Trailers with heavy loads, high vertical sideloads (like camper trailers), or trailers with inadequate tongue weight can be affected by trailer sway problems. Automotive bias or radial tires with their more flexible sidewalls can accentuate trailer sway problems, whereas the stiffer sidewalls of the ST (special trailer) bias ply tires help to control and reduce sway problems. For this reason it is not recommended that (P) Passenger or (LT) Light Truck tires be used on trailers. Best trailer control will be achieved with (ST) Special Trailer tires."
as for testing it is pretty much identical except for two tests, the P tires have one test that the ST does different, and the ST has a much more extreme full load test so how is that inferior, they are testing for two different things as neither is supposed to be used for the other.
* This post was edited 09/02/23 06:37pm by an administrator/moderator *
I believe in the testing standards.The standards are much tougher for LTs...That is just a fact. It is also WHY it is prfectly legal to use LTs on a trailer....And why it is illegal to use an ST on an automobile....In fact it is so illeagal that it MUST state this on an ST tires sidewall.
* This post was edited 09/04/23 08:13am by an administrator/moderator *
Is that like being dead is just like being SO dead?
![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/awink.gif "awink")
Barney
2004 Sunnybrook Titan 30FKS TT
Hensley "Arrow" 1400# hitch (Sold)
Not towing now.
Former tow vehicles were 2016 Ram 2500 CTD, 2002 Ford F250, 7.3 PSD, 1997 Ram 2500 5.9 gas engine
Huntindog wrote:
You can believe the marketing propaganda if you wish.
I believe in the testing standards.The standards are much tougher for LTs...That is just a fact. It is also WHY it is prfectly legal to use LTs on a trailer....And why it is illegal to use an ST on an automobile....In fact it is so illeagal that it MUST state this on an ST tires sidewall.
You can believe the marketing propaganda if you wish.
I believe in the testing standards.The standards are much tougher for LTs...That is just a fact. It is also WHY it is prfectly legal to use LTs on a trailer....And why it is illegal to use an ST on an automobile....In fact it is so illeagal that it MUST state this on an ST tires sidewall.
Haha, I thought of you as I was pulling a guys old Travel Trailer this weekend.
It was a grungy old junker and I was being nice, but without even looking at it, I brought a floor jack and lug wrench so a blowout would be an easy repair.
It did blow one tire in the 600miles I pulled it, too fast for the tires. I was semi shocked to see 2004 mfg dates on all of them when I changed that one though! That blowout was the owners fault, not the tire.
Huntindog wrote:
You need 3" clearance from the top of the tire to the wheelwell. If needed a small lift block can be used. I needed a 1" block on one of the TTs. cheap and easy to do. As far as limiting the payback, you seem to be conceeding that STs do fail more often. This is good. Recognizing a problem is halfway there to a solution. But financial payback is just a small part of it. Not having to deal with a torn up TT, and ruined trips are other forms of payback. How do you put a value on these? And finally IMO, (and the GOVT.testing standards,) there is no such thing as a quality ST tire.
They certainly are tested to lower standards and thats a fact. Not opinion. Another fun fact:It is illegal to put ST tires on automobiles, But perfectly legal to put LTs on trailers.There are reasons for this.(hint; lower testing standards for STs). Take a look at all the choices available for 16" LT tires. Most if not all brands have several price points and quality points to choose from. IE: Good, Better,Best. In ST tires each brand has ONE offering.
You need 3" clearance from the top of the tire to the wheelwell. If needed a small lift block can be used. I needed a 1" block on one of the TTs. cheap and easy to do. As far as limiting the payback, you seem to be conceeding that STs do fail more often. This is good. Recognizing a problem is halfway there to a solution. But financial payback is just a small part of it. Not having to deal with a torn up TT, and ruined trips are other forms of payback. How do you put a value on these? And finally IMO, (and the GOVT.testing standards,) there is no such thing as a quality ST tire.
They certainly are tested to lower standards and thats a fact. Not opinion. Another fun fact:It is illegal to put ST tires on automobiles, But perfectly legal to put LTs on trailers.There are reasons for this.(hint; lower testing standards for STs). Take a look at all the choices available for 16" LT tires. Most if not all brands have several price points and quality points to choose from. IE: Good, Better,Best. In ST tires each brand has ONE offering.
PS, not everyone owns a trailer that this is possible on. Not everyone is high miles, nor does everyone keep their trailers for a decade or however long it would be to not just be an upgrade for the “next guy.”
And what’s funny (and I’ve acknowledged this before) is you’re right from an ultimate durability standpoint, not even debatable. What’s funnier though is you cannot seem to acknowledge that doing any less than what you’ve done to bulletproof a past trailer is still ok.
Pride of authorship is the issue I suppose?
Huntindog wrote:
Changing rim sizes sizes is commonly done in order to run better tires.
For some reason, the anti LT tire crowd insists that one MUST use the factory sizes.
How do you like the 37"s on your TV?
Grit dog wrote:
^Bingo. Something lost on the “LT tires only” crowd.
But as I mentioned above, there are a couple 15” LRE tires out there. May have to upsize to a 235.
However there is a virtual plethora of good heavy duty 15” ST tires available. AND not horribly expensive to boot. And universally available.
No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel. Literally or figuratively.
Nothing is "lost"^Bingo. Something lost on the “LT tires only” crowd.
But as I mentioned above, there are a couple 15” LRE tires out there. May have to upsize to a 235.
However there is a virtual plethora of good heavy duty 15” ST tires available. AND not horribly expensive to boot. And universally available.
No sense in trying to reinvent the wheel. Literally or figuratively.
Changing rim sizes sizes is commonly done in order to run better tires.
For some reason, the anti LT tire crowd insists that one MUST use the factory sizes.
How do you like the 37"s on your TV?
"Factory size tires"?? Interesting. I checked the sticker on the Jayco I just bought because it had LT tires on it and I wondered what the factory called for. Glory be, the factory sticker called for LT tires! If they were good enough for the Jayco factory, they are certainly good enough for me! I think I will leave them on there...
CM1, USN (RET)
2017 Jayco TT
Daily Driver: '14 Subaru Outback
1998 Dodge QC LWB, Cummins, 5 speed, 4X2
2 Kawasaki Brute Force 750 ATVs.
Pride Raptor 3 wheeled off-road capable mobility scooter
"When seconds count, help is only minutes away!"