My question:
I understand that standard practice for manufacturers is to mark the center of gravity at the longitudinal center of the portion of the camper in the truck bed (108"/2=54") Since the center of my box is 80"/2=40', that puts the camper CG 14" behind the axle. The manufacturers method for finding CG seems flawed since they ignore the 6' of sleeper which is over the truck cab.
Has anyone put a similar sized camper in a short box truck and had any wonky experiences with it?
I'm on the fence about it but the price is definitely right.
* This post was edited 04/10/22 11:06pm by ssthrd *
2014 Keystone Laredo 292RL
2013 Palomino Maverick 2902
2018 GMC 3500HD, 4x4, 6.5' box, SRW, Denali, Duramax, Andersen
DeeBee, JayBee, and Jed the Black Lab
The hurrier I go the behinder I get. (Lewis Carroll)
Regarding your other question, is it a short bed camper or not? At 9’ long, it would be one of, if not the longest short bed suitable campers out there.
Other than that, you have zero issue with weight.
And even if it’s not a SB camper, it’s very light weight for a camper that long. If it doesn’t have a rear overhang that would prohibit running with the tailgate on, I’d consider running it like that.
And even assuming if the CoG is a foot or so behind the axle, if you do the math it likely doesn’t remove enough weight off the front axle to be of worry.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold
Looking at specs, pictures and the floorplan, I believe it should work fine with your truck from a weight perspective. To know for sure, take your empty truck to a scale and get the actual axle weights. The difference between the RAWR on the door sticker and the empty weight of the rear axle will give you a good idea of the available payload in this scenario. Expect all of the camper weight to go to the back. If your truck has single rear wheels, be aware that the RAWR of your truck may be the sum of the load ratings of your rear tires, so if you overload the axle, you may overload the tires -which wouldn't be a good idea.
How well the camper holds up with more than 2ft sticking out in the back unsupported is another question. I have no idea.
I hope some more comments will come in.
Please excuse me if you know some or all of this already:
The CoG of the camper depends a lot on where the heavy items are - water and propane tanks, battery, appliances. Usually, it is somewhere around the first third from the front bulkhead. Obviously, the position of the actual CoG changes somewhat with the way you load the camper - where and how much you put inside.
In theory, if you were to jack the camper up at its actual CoG, you could balance it there.
If the camper CoG is exactly over the rear axle, ALL the weight of the camper goes to the rear axle and the weight on the front axle remains unchanged.
If the camper CoG is in front of the rear axle, some of the camper weight is transferred to the front. This is the preferred loading situation.
However, if the camper CoG is behind the rear axle, not only all the camper weight goes to the rear - some weight gets transferred away from the front and the axle gets lighter - which is not good for the handling of the rig on the road (in the extreme, the rear would tip over and the front would be lifted off the ground.)
* This post was edited 04/11/22 03:10am by joerg68 *
2014 Ford F350 XLT 6.2 SCLB + 2017 Northstar Arrow
ssthrd wrote:
I understand that standard practice for manufacturers is to mark the center of gravity at the longitudinal center of the portion of the camper in the truck bed (108"/2=54")
I understand that standard practice for manufacturers is to mark the center of gravity at the longitudinal center of the portion of the camper in the truck bed (108"/2=54")
Not sure where you are getting that....the manufacturer determines COG based on location of fresh water tank, slide outs, and other heavy items, and it does take into account the cabover portion from a weight perspective. If you can't find the COG online you should call the camper manufacturer and ask.
'18 Bigfoot 1500
Torklifts and Fastguns
'17 F350 Powerstroke Supercab SRW LB 4X4
joerg68 wrote:
I found no reference stating if an M-800 should go on a short bed or not. All the pictures I found seem show it on LB trucks. Even the TCM article doesn't elaborate:
I found no reference stating if an M-800 should go on a short bed or not. All the pictures I found seem show it on LB trucks. Even the TCM article doesn't elaborate:
Same here, but they do appear to be flat on the bottom all the way to the back of the camper, so I'd wager one would be able to use it on a short bed with the tailgate down for a little added support.
Appears it's about 3" longer than the AF 860/811 campers that I'm familiar with and hauled on a shortbed truck, both with and without tailgate.
COG is 27" on the HS-750.
The HS-750 is advertised, "1/2 Ton Truck w/ 5’6” up to 8’ Bed."
So, much ado about nothing. You will be fine.
Putting 10-ply tires on half ton trucks since aught-four.
Good info mkirsch. 27" seems way more reasonable. Thanks
The CoG thing came from an article on the internet, so I took that with a grain of salt. My best subject was always Physics, so I didn't believe it anyway. The only heavy thing at the rear is the black holding tank which is only 4 gallons if I remember right. Everything else is forward including the propane tank, and the fresh water tank.
Gonna chance it--I can always resell if it won't work.
Thanks again.
* This post was edited 04/11/22 10:52am by ssthrd *
I will run it with the tailgate down, and it should work great. It does seem to be on the light side for that size, but the aluminum frame probably makes a difference. There is a truck scale on the way, so I'll duck in and see what it is just for fun. I'm not worried about it.
Tie down tech sure has come a long way since the last camper we had. Cost me almost $1000 CDN for frame mounts and turnbuckles. Yikes!
mkirsch wrote:
Gotta love not having to drill the frame for the tiedowns. That's worth $500CDN in and of itself.
Gotta love not having to drill the frame for the tiedowns. That's worth $500CDN in and of itself.
For sure. Just a bit frustrating while lying on my back on the ground and trying to fish a half inch bolt with a couple of washers from one hole to another inside the frame and get it to standup enough to drop thru a 9/16 hole when you get it there.
Getting it thru the hole was an exercise involving a bit of colourful language and a beer break to clear the mind, but in the end, it's all good.
A cut-off saw came to mind once, but a cooler head (not mine) prevailed.
![[emoticon]](http://www.coastresorts.com/sharedcontent/cfb/images/smile.gif "smile")
The fronts were a pain, but the rears were a piece of cake.
Regarding aluminum vs wood weight. It “may” be a bit lighter but can say, on a totally different camper, I had 2 of the same models. 1 Al frame, 1 wood frame and could not tell any difference in weight. On the upside, I had the Al one first and thought that was what I “wanted”. Then bought the older one after selling the first one in Alaska before returning to the L48 and the older wood one went through just as tough of conditions and showed no signs of fatigue or other issues.
Although admittedly, I didn’t care about weight and haven’t ever run any of my rigs across a scale except at the garbage dump.
It's a stiff wire that's straight for a distance and wound into a spring on one end. The bolt threads into the spring. You fish the fish through the frame and out the desired hole, then pull the bolt through. Lots easier than randomly poking at it with a long screwdriver.
Pulling the bolt from hole to hole was easy, but to get it to stand up to get it lined up for the second hole was the hard part. Once I got it to 45* with a jewelers screw driver and needle nose pliers, it fell in. A lesson in patience.
PastorCharlie wrote:
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
Not worth the effort. COG simply is not that important. If you stop and actually READ your owner's manual you will see that the COG range in your truck bed is from the front to the back. The picture shows a narrow range, but the numbers are 0" and 78" for a 6-1/2' bed, 0" and 96" for an 8' bed.
This means the COG of the camper can be literally ANYWHERE in the bed according to the manufacturer.
You can have a 5000lb camper with the COG 12" behind the axle, and it will have the same effect as 500lbs on the trailer ball. So again, COG is not all that important.
PastorCharlie wrote:
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
Is this just something you thought was a good idea, or have you done it in the past?
What you said works on a chalk board in physics class, but I can think of a half dozen reasons why, just off the top of my head that this is either not practical, not possible or not even remotely necessary.
And, if it’s that interesting, loading it up and running each truck axle onto a scale empty and loaded will get you the same info with a little more math and a lot less effort and potential damage.
It’s not like you’re gonna do this in the sellers driveway before buying the camper.
mkirsch wrote:
Not worth the effort. COG simply is not that important. If you stop and actually READ your owner's manual you will see that the COG range in your truck bed is from the front to the back. The picture shows a narrow range, but the numbers are 0" and 78" for a 6-1/2' bed, 0" and 96" for an 8' bed.
This means the COG of the camper can be literally ANYWHERE in the bed according to the manufacturer.
You can have a 5000lb camper with the COG 12" behind the axle, and it will have the same effect as 500lbs on the trailer ball. So again, COG is not all that important.
PastorCharlie wrote:
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
To find the center of gravity unload the camper onto a good level surface, preferably on concrete, and lower it onto a piece of pipe across the suspected center of gravity. If it balances that is it, if not move the pipe to the lower end until it is balanced. Mark the location.
Not worth the effort. COG simply is not that important. If you stop and actually READ your owner's manual you will see that the COG range in your truck bed is from the front to the back. The picture shows a narrow range, but the numbers are 0" and 78" for a 6-1/2' bed, 0" and 96" for an 8' bed.
This means the COG of the camper can be literally ANYWHERE in the bed according to the manufacturer.
You can have a 5000lb camper with the COG 12" behind the axle, and it will have the same effect as 500lbs on the trailer ball. So again, COG is not all that important.
It's all good.
A bit of movement in a side wind but almost negligible. No porpoising at all, so good to go! Rear sagged an inch, front came up maybe ¼".
Scale was closed, so no weight, but no need. Drives great.
ssthrd wrote:
I'm looking at the slide in camper above which is 108" in the bed of my 80" box. The advertised dry weight is 1675lbs, so probably 2500lbs or so on the road. I figure that with my wife and my dog plus whatever else we may have inside the truck will be maybe another 500lbs, so total weight probably in the 3,000lb area. The payload sticker on the door is 3470lbs, so I should be good to go for total weight.
My question:
I understand that standard practice for manufacturers is to mark the center of gravity at the longitudinal center of the portion of the camper in the truck bed (108"/2=54") Since the center of my box is 80"/2=40', that puts the camper CG 14" behind the axle. The manufacturers method for finding CG seems flawed since they ignore the 6' of sleeper which is over the truck cab.
Has anyone put a similar sized camper in a short box truck and had any wonky experiences with it?
I'm on the fence about it but the price is definitely right.
I'm looking at the slide in camper above which is 108" in the bed of my 80" box. The advertised dry weight is 1675lbs, so probably 2500lbs or so on the road. I figure that with my wife and my dog plus whatever else we may have inside the truck will be maybe another 500lbs, so total weight probably in the 3,000lb area. The payload sticker on the door is 3470lbs, so I should be good to go for total weight.
My question:
I understand that standard practice for manufacturers is to mark the center of gravity at the longitudinal center of the portion of the camper in the truck bed (108"/2=54") Since the center of my box is 80"/2=40', that puts the camper CG 14" behind the axle. The manufacturers method for finding CG seems flawed since they ignore the 6' of sleeper which is over the truck cab.
Has anyone put a similar sized camper in a short box truck and had any wonky experiences with it?
I'm on the fence about it but the price is definitely right.
COG is not simply the length in the bed and beyond halved. Your understanding is incorrect. I would suggest you to contact the manufacturer.
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How's the build quality of the Palomono units? I haven't looked at one in the flesh, but they look OK on-line and I like the idea of aluminum construction
Unless you have a camper package 250, that gen of 250 is soft in the rear. I’ve had a couple of them.
Bags or springs will be needed for sure. And a large rear sway bar will be preferable. If you have an OE sway bar try it first. If you have none and have the budget just get a big sway bar. You’ll want it. No questions.
Sounds like fun.
Be aware they had a small black tank. Not sure what the new one's have.
I really liked it but the wife didn't like the 5cu ft fridge and the distance from the floor to the bed. Short "old" people are cry babies! She was always saying she was going to fall out of the bed and break her hip.
Sold it and got one with a basement, now she's happy. Of course it weighs about twice as much.
I visited the factory where they were made in Michigan just north of Shipshewana, IN. Nothing ground breaking but it always nice to know what goes into their production.
Joe & Evelyn
