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Topic: Small Four Season TT
Posted By: Larry7995 on 03/29/18 06:38am

I have been looking at TTs now since last fall. Just need one for 2 people. My neighbor asked me if I was getting a 4 season trailer which opened a new search. Since I live in Colorado and mtn temps can drop into the 20s even in the summer, that seemed a no-brainer. So I was wandering around an RV lot and discovered the ORV trailers, very nice but sort of heavy. Friend from Montana suggested I look at Nash and Arctic Fox, they are very nice as well. Price keeps going up the more I look. So the Northwood Nash 22 is nice and only 4300 lb dry weight, the ORV - Creek Side 21RBS is decent but 5300 lbs dry weight. I have a new F-150 3.5L Ecoboost with Max Tow and it is a great truck but still want to be mindful of weight. Also, was wondering how much pulling the trailers into rutted dirt forest camp sites becomes a consideration as they become heavier. Also looking at the ORV 21FQS at 6000 lbs. And the Arctic Fox 22
http://outdoorsrvmfg.com/creek-side/creek-side-21rbs/
http://northwoodmfg.com/compare/1/49/nash-22h/
http://outdoorsrvmfg.com/timber-ridge-21fqs/
http://northwoodmfg.com/arctic-fox-2/arctic-fox-22g/

* This post was edited 03/29/18 06:52am by Larry7995 *

Posted By: lawrosa on 03/29/18 07:04am

ORV makes their own off road frames and have shock suspension.

Nash was the Father and ORV is a knock off from family members.

There is really no such thing as a 4 season lightweight rv... Its just thermofoil **** that IMO do little for r value..

with 2: walls and 5: roof you can only get so much insulation r value.

Mike L ... N.J.

2006 Silverado ext cab long bed. 3:42 rear. LM7 5.3 motor. 300 hp 350 ft lbs torgue @ 4000 rpms
2018 coachmen Catalina sbx 261bh


Posted By: Fireballsocal on 03/29/18 07:13am

Lance, escape, and bigfoot make great 4 season lightweight trailers. I think the brands you listed are really well respected standard weight trailers and have a good following here on the forum. Your truck shouldn't have an issue with any of them but checking out the 3 I listed can't hurt.

Posted By: lawrosa on 03/29/18 07:19am

I would wait and see the weight of the 21 kvs... Thats a cool floorplan..

2019 Outdoors RV Mountain Creek Side 21KVS

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Posted By: ppine on 03/29/18 08:01am

Nash. Arctic Fox, Outdoors RV.

Posted By: afidel on 03/29/18 08:44am

lawrosa wrote:

I would wait and see the weight of the 21 kvs... Thats a cool floorplan..

2019 Outdoors RV Mountain Creek Side 21KVS



To each their own but if you're going to have rear panoramic windows why not make it so you can actually sit and enjoy them, give me the 21RD with either the dinette or the recliner option. You also get a full queen with the 21RD, only an RV queen with the 21KVS which is a deal killer for me.

2019 Dutchman Kodiak 293RLSL
2015 GMC 1500 Sierra 4x4 5.3 3.42 full bed
Equalizer 10k WDH


Posted By: Larry7995 on 03/29/18 09:05am

The 21RD is lighter at about 5000 than the other Outdoors RV floorplans as it doesn't have a slide. I am bouncing around like a ping pong ball with all the cool trailers to choose from [emoticon]

Posted By: myredracer on 03/29/18 09:05am

Lance or one of the Northwoods products. Way better insulated all round.

The problem with all TTs is that removal of moisture laden air is not addressed. At a min., you need to crack open windows & roof vents. If camping for extended periods, you need a dehumidifier (electric). A tremendous amount of moisture is released into the air from human bodies, pets, cooking & showering and if not removed will lead to rot, delamination & mold. A better insulated TT helps a lot, but never seal up all the cracks and openings to conserve heat. "Regular" TTs are just not very well insulated.

If it were me, I'd check out TTs with a Murphy bed. More space during the day and a place to lounge and watch TV. Our 1st TT was 20' and we sold it after a year because it was just too cramped. It was not enjoyable to spend time inside other than sleeping.

There was a guy that toughed out a winter in an R-pod in the Yukon. Trailer Life story here. Not exactly the best choice for brutally cold -40C temps. He lived to tell the tale though... [emoticon]

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Posted By: Larry7995 on 03/29/18 09:37am

Looking at pricing on RV Trader, seems I could save $5-$10K by driving out to the coast as opposed to buying locally in Colorado. Being totally new to this process, it might be helpful to have a local dealer to answer all my questions but then again they have Owners Manuals.

Posted By: BizmarksMom on 03/29/18 10:15am

I tow my Nash 22h up all over the Sawtooths in Idaho with an F150. I have not had problems pulling that trailer down any dirt road I've wanted to. The combination works really well for me.

2019 F350 towing a Nash 22H

Posted By: profdant139 on 03/29/18 10:17am

Someone mentioned that all of the four season trailers are insulated with thermofoil (reflectix) -- I think that ORV uses thick styrofoam in the walls and ceilings. My little Fun Finder is surprisingly well insulated with sytrofoam -- we have been comfortable in temps down to ten degrees at night. But the underbelly is not enclosed, which would be necessary for true four-season camping.

And yes, ventilation is crucial. So if it is really, really cold (like zero), you will have to have a source of heat.

2012 Fun Finder X-139 "Boondock Style" (axle-flipped and extra insulation)
2013 Toyota Tacoma Off-Road (semi-beefy tires and components)
Our trips -- pix and text
About our trailer
"A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single list."


Posted By: Larry7995 on 03/29/18 11:18am

BizmarksMom wrote:

I tow my Nash 22h up all over the Sawtooths in Idaho with an F150. I have not had problems pulling that trailer down any dirt road I've wanted to. The combination works really well for me.


Good to know! I am going to Lazydays and walk thru a 22H and 23D this Saturday.

Posted By: goducks10 on 03/29/18 01:47pm

Larry7995 wrote:

BizmarksMom wrote:

I tow my Nash 22h up all over the Sawtooths in Idaho with an F150. I have not had problems pulling that trailer down any dirt road I've wanted to. The combination works really well for me.


Good to know! I am going to Lazydays and walk thru a 22H and 23D this Saturday.


Don't expect very much bling. Beauty is really skin deep in Northwood trailers.

Posted By: TurnThePage on 03/29/18 01:56pm

I think any of those shorter Nash or Outdoors trailers would pull well behind any capable half ton. For reference, my trailer, which is similar in size and weight to some of those, pulls very well behind my current and previous half ton. And I'm specifically talking about mountainous, rocky, snowy, muddy terrain.

I personally would lean toward the Outdoors brand because of the variety and options in the shorter models. The only thing they're missing is the built in gen.

2015 Ram 1500
2022 Grand Design Imagine XLS 22RBE

Posted By: theoldwizard1 on 03/29/18 03:41pm

A true 4 seasons trailer has to be able to survive a 3 day ski outing with the temps below 0F at night and never above freezing. You need heated water tanks, pipe and valves. Extra wall and ceiling insulation are important and and insulated floor is also a must.

Boondocking in winter is out unless you are willing to carry water in jugs and use a portable toilet. For a 3 day weekend I would want at least THREE 20 lb LP battles, maybe FOUR ! You probably won't be able to use your furnace because it will kill your batteries.

Posted By: Dirtpig on 03/29/18 05:17pm

I really like the wood framing in my Nash 25c. I had an Arctic Fox camper that was aluminum framed and even though it was well insulated it showed moisture on the inside walls where the frame was. This was the only place you could see moisture, weird phenomenon that does not happen in my wooden framed trailer i now have. Im guessing it was transferring the cold from the outside through the aluminum into the inside wall. You could see a grid pattern if u looked closely in the right light, or u could feel the moisture with your hand. The Nash models have heated enclosed tanks and valves, thermal windows, and a good R value. I have camped for 1 week using furnace nightly boondocking and my 2 6volt batteries will go down to about 70% in one night with some tv use, and the furnace set at 21deg Celsius. I would say it cycles on about once every 45min and runs for about 10min at about -3 Celsius. Nothing has ever frozen on me. No valves etc. The weakest link on these trailers is the outside shower, they are suseptable to freezing and i would recommend leaving them winterized with antifreeze. (dont flush them out when u dewinterize when winter camping). I am very pleased with the winter performance of the trailer, and in summer the sun doesnt make the trailer an oven. Holds the same temp as the outside air temp. My best friend has a ORV Creekside 23BHS and it also performs well in sub zero temps and he is also happy with his choice. Nash 17k is a nice little trailer with no slide and large rear window.

2015 Nash 25C bumper pull /w 300watts solar my install
My Truck & RV youtube channel
2005 F-350 Diesel 4x4 CC SB SRW
2001 Honda XR400: many mods
12ft Lund WC boat & 9.9 Yamaha 4 stroke on custom loader.


Posted By: Larry7995 on 03/30/18 11:56pm

Did you folks that purchased Nash trailers get the Onan LP generator option? Is that a good idea or better to get two external gas generators in tandem?
I am excited to go see the Nash and Arctic Fox models tomorrow.

Posted By: BizmarksMom on 03/31/18 09:39am

I already owned 2 Honda generators, so I did not buy the Onan. And, honestly, between the solar mounted on the roof and my portable panel, I haven't needed the generators in years. I don't use the air conditioner or microwave, though.

Posted By: Larry7995 on 10/27/18 05:52am

I found a used 2015 Nash 23d up in Idaho. Unfortunately, they are waiting for a part they need to replace the motor for the slideout and have no idea when they are going to get it from Northwood Manufacturing. So, I put a credit card deposit down but I am not willing to sign any financing documents till they have a trailer that is not broken and has a part available to fix it!

Posted By: jnslprd on 10/27/18 08:14pm

Don't believe the listed prices they can vary greatly. Look on RVtrader at the model you want and look for the lowest price. Any Northwood dealer should be able to match the lowest listed price. As for bling, it depends what you consider bling. The Northwood units have everything any other model has but on a better built frame and better quality materials. Good luck, My wife and I are waiting for our Arctic fox 25w to arrive in a few weeks.

Posted By: carringb on 10/27/18 08:45pm

ORV and the AF/Nash trailers all use the Northwoods chassis. The main difference being only that ORV trailers took over the former Fleetwood plant that the Nash family bought after Fleetwood left the towable market. They have most thing in common, including construction methods. The biggest differences are floor-plans and amenities.

2000 Ford E450 V10 VAN! 450,000+ miles
2014 ORV really big trailer
2015 Ford Focus ST


Posted By: Larry7995 on 10/27/18 11:15pm

Thanks for the history, I was at Ketelsen today looking at ORVs, for my purposes the 18RBS would be ok but I did not like the tiny shower, the shower in the 21FQS is much better. But I am supposed to get a 2015 Nash for less than half what they want for the 2019 18RBS so I am hoping they get the part and that fixes the slideout, then I will run up to Idaho and bring it back to Colorado.

Posted By: Larry7995 on 11/17/18 09:54am

Well Camping World - Caldwell was unable to procure the part from Northwood Manufacturing that they needed to fix the slide out on the used Nash 23D I was buying so they sent my deposit back. Slide outs often break after 3 years?

Posted By: goducks10 on 11/17/18 05:45pm

The 23D uses a Schwintek type slide out. I think there's a couple MFG that make that type. Could very well be that Northwood uses a different or a newer version and no longer stocks the parts. Looking up the actual MFG of the slide out would be where I would go.
I don't have that type of slide out mechanism and it's never failed in 6 seasons.
Hard to say how the original owner treated it.

Posted By: carringb on 11/17/18 07:32pm

Schwintek slide systems are garbage. Fortunately AF-Nash/Northwoods have moved away from it for larger slides. Mine had to go back to the factory a couple times, plus one dealer repair, and finally one more in my driveway a couple months ago. Seems to be ok on smaller slides, but not full-room slides (that said, one of my failures was the bedroom slide, but it was just a bad motor).

Posted By: deltabravo on 11/17/18 10:29pm

ppine wrote:

Nash. Arctic Fox, Outdoors RV.

Ditto

For ORV: I really like the 21RBS. The 20RD was my second choice.
18RBS would work too, but the corner bed would be annoying for a couple.

2009 Silverado 3500HD Dually, D/A, CCLB 4x4 (bought new 8/30/09)
2018 Arctic Fox 992 with an Onan 2500i "quiet" model generator

Posted By: ppine on 11/18/18 07:53am

I had a Nash 22 and miss it. It was heavy. The newer ones are lighter.

I just came back from a mid Nov trip in the mountains with an old Tahoe Lite. It is not verywell insulated, but compared to being outside it was perfect. I just left the antifreeze in place. I used a Little Buddy heater with the hybrid turtled up. Making coffee heated up the small space.

Posted By: FrankShore on 11/18/18 10:03pm

I like Lance, and with some reading up on some of their construction videos at YouTube and just reading their website, you can see that the smallest Lance 1475 has a 4 Season Package. I've never been cold in my Lance. Azdel (a composite material used within the walls (instead of Luan - regular wood) keeps the temps nice and warm in the cold months.

Lance Factory Tour

2014 F-250
2014 Minnie Winnie 2351DKS (Traded In-Burnout-Use A Surge Protector!)
2015 Arctic Fox 22G (Great Trailer But Heavy - Traded In)
2018 Lance 1685 w/ Solar & 4 Seasons Package
1999 Beneteau 461 Oceanis Yacht
En Norski i en Fransk båt - Dette må jeg se!

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