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TBammer wrote:
Can you drive to the top of the pass and then turn around and return to Hwy 550 in a regular pick up truck.
NO!
I've seen vids of the section from the Stairsteps into Telluride and I know my truck is not doing that, but I would like to see the view from the top.
Can you drive to the top of the pass and then turn around and return to Hwy 550 in a regular pick up truck.
NO!
I've seen vids of the section from the Stairsteps into Telluride and I know my truck is not doing that, but I would like to see the view from the top.
Black Bear Pass
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But to answer your question, no Chevy 2500, even with 4WD, is going to be able to get to the top--the road is too narrow. You might be able to drive it over Ophir Pass, but even on that you will have to do multiple turns to get around the hairpins. I've had to do that on Ophir and Cinnamon Passes even with a mid-size truck (Ford Ranger and Nissan Frontier).
Not too many years ago, some idiot drove a 3/4-ton truck up one of the jeep roads in the San Juans and couldn't turn around, so he drove out onto the tundra to the edge of a cliff. Couldn't back up, couldn't turn around, and now he was really stuck. The truck was finally taken apart and hauled out by heavy-lift helicopter. He not only got the bill for that, but he also got fined $20,000 by the Forest Service for destroying the tundra!
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Years ago I had a mildly modded Xterra and there were a lot of guys with similar rigs from CO who ran it successfully. My current truck isn't as good offroad just from a size and weight standpoint, but it does have some advantages with bigger tires, more torque and solid axles on both ends compared to my old X.
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----------------------------------------------------
Yeah, we have a long bed F350 4FWD and took it over Cinnamon. On a few hairpins I had to do some backing and froing to get around. It seems like those were mainly after the pass on the way down to the Animas ghost town. It was well worth it tho. The view from the pass is incredible, like nothing you'll see driving the paved roads in RMNP or Glacier. Engineer's pass road was closed on the west side so we missed that. I had been told the interconnect between Cinnamon and Engineers was not to be done in a big 4WD so we didn't try it.
When we stopped in Animas to look around some of the jeep drivers were asking us if we had any difficulty with the road. We really didn't, but we've driven a lot of 4WD roads of less vertical nature so we were mentally prepared. WE also hit some roads in Canyonlands that we just turned around on after hitting some 18 inch steps. And one terrifying road in Capitol Reef that made me a real believer in stopping when you hit a "JEEPS ONLY" sign. That one had me praying non-stop that we would live to the other end.
There were a lot of rental jeeps and quads going over Cinnamon. Think the jeeps were like $220/day in Ouray (where we we staying). One of those would be a better option for you.
In Moab I drove down Long Canyon without problem (low range would have been nice, but not essential)
In Teluride I drove a short ways UP Black Bear, just enough to get a good view of slope. Since there was a festival in town (Blues and Brews), the campground in town was full. Instead I drove up to Alta Lakes (typical Forest Service road) where we spent a blustery night.
I was planning on driving some of the easier passes (possibly even to the top of Black Bear as proposed by the OP). The Element doesn't have much clearance, but has a great turning radius - so turning tail when the going gets too rough is an option). But with the storm, I decided it was wiser to stick with paved roads, and instead looped around to Ouray and Silverton and down to Durango and Cortez.
On a previous trip I'd taken a S10 (extended cab, 4x4) from Silverton to Ouray via Animas Forks. I was intending to take Engineer Pass but there was snow on the north side.
* This post was edited 11/16/17 12:38pm by paulj *
Don't Colorado West Tours and Telluride Outside use full size pickup trucks for their tour businesses? If so, that proves a pickup is not too wide.
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TBammer wrote:
I have seen a lot of vids of the road(?) into Telluride, but had not seen anything about the drive from the highway up to the pass. Sounds like Cinnamon pass or a tour ride. Thanks for the advice.
I have seen a lot of vids of the road(?) into Telluride, but had not seen anything about the drive from the highway up to the pass. Sounds like Cinnamon pass or a tour ride. Thanks for the advice.
Here is a 4x4 route review of Black Bear including video of the east end of the trail to the pass. It has waypoints and route description for you to make your own decision. The first 3 minutes of video cover getting to Black Bear Pass...
trailsoffroad.com - Black Bear Pass
* This post was edited 11/16/17 09:21am by Off Pavement *
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Off Pavement wrote:
Here is a 4x4 route review of Black Bear including video of the east end of the trail to the pass. It has waypoints and route description for you to make your own decision. The first 3 minutes of video cover getting to Black Bear Pass...
trailsoffroad.com - Black Bear Pass
TBammer wrote:
I have seen a lot of vids of the road(?) into Telluride, but had not seen anything about the drive from the highway up to the pass. Sounds like Cinnamon pass or a tour ride. Thanks for the advice.
I have seen a lot of vids of the road(?) into Telluride, but had not seen anything about the drive from the highway up to the pass. Sounds like Cinnamon pass or a tour ride. Thanks for the advice.
Here is a 4x4 route review of Black Bear including video of the east end of the trail to the pass. It has waypoints and route description for you to make your own decision. The first 3 minutes of video cover getting to Black Bear Pass...
trailsoffroad.com - Black Bear Pass
It likes there is a place to turn around at the summit. I did not see anything in the pictures that a 4 wheel pickup couldn't handle. Might want to make sure there is some weight in the bed, but the truck has as much ground clearance as the vehicles in the photos. Really looks beautiful.
As a kid I lived in the Andes, and rode in Landrovers on similar roads. Even the short wheelbase ones tended to require multipoint turns, but being in the back of a long wheelbase one was scarier.
IdaD wrote:
Based on pictures it doesn't look too hairy aside from the dropoffs that don't really make it harder, just scarier. I dunno. If a full size Hummer can do it which many seem able based on pictures I don't see why a qualified driver in an adequate full size truck couldn't also (meaning some skills and good tires, obviously 4wd with low range - better yet with lockers and swaybars disconnected).
Years ago I had a mildly modded Xterra and there were a lot of guys with similar rigs from CO who ran it successfully. My current truck isn't as good offroad just from a size and weight standpoint, but it does have some advantages with bigger tires, more torque and solid axles on both ends compared to my old X.
Based on pictures it doesn't look too hairy aside from the dropoffs that don't really make it harder, just scarier. I dunno. If a full size Hummer can do it which many seem able based on pictures I don't see why a qualified driver in an adequate full size truck couldn't also (meaning some skills and good tires, obviously 4wd with low range - better yet with lockers and swaybars disconnected).
Years ago I had a mildly modded Xterra and there were a lot of guys with similar rigs from CO who ran it successfully. My current truck isn't as good offroad just from a size and weight standpoint, but it does have some advantages with bigger tires, more torque and solid axles on both ends compared to my old X.
Plain and simple - the guys behind you will push you off the road after you take 30 minutes to one switch back - some jeeps take 5+ minutes to make the turn. Tight - and Narrow - SEE HERE
If you decide to go in a regular Pick Up let us all know - so as to not be there waiting on YOU.
As for ground clearance, it's not just how much spacing is under the axles. Vehicle length must also be considered. Don't know what your truck configuration is, but you can imagine that a crew cab with an 8' bed will hang up on a lot smaller obstacle than a short bed standard cab.
If you decide to do Ophir, the tricky part is on the west side of the pass. There aren't many good passing places for a mile or so near the summit. If travelling east to west, stop at the last switchback going down and look for traffic coming up. You can see the road coming up around the amphitheater or bowl. We've sat there and waited for 15 minutes or more waiting for the traffic to clear so we didn't have to try to pass someone.
I've done the whole thing in our 96 4Runner. Taller tires, rear locker, pretty good 4x4 capabilities. (We notice that when one gets to the really tough trails, one sees Jeeps and Toyotas.) We went over the pass after it had snowed a little the night before. The section along the stream gorge just before the waterfalls was pretty extreme pucker with everything being wet with a skim of slush on it.
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Busskipper wrote:
Plain and simple - the guys behind you will push you off the road after you take 30 minutes to one switch back - some jeeps take 5+ minutes to make the turn. Tight - and Narrow - SEE HERE
If you decide to go in a regular Pick Up let us all know - so as to not be there waiting on YOU.
IdaD wrote:
Based on pictures it doesn't look too hairy aside from the dropoffs that don't really make it harder, just scarier. I dunno. If a full size Hummer can do it which many seem able based on pictures I don't see why a qualified driver in an adequate full size truck couldn't also (meaning some skills and good tires, obviously 4wd with low range - better yet with lockers and swaybars disconnected).
Years ago I had a mildly modded Xterra and there were a lot of guys with similar rigs from CO who ran it successfully. My current truck isn't as good offroad just from a size and weight standpoint, but it does have some advantages with bigger tires, more torque and solid axles on both ends compared to my old X.
Based on pictures it doesn't look too hairy aside from the dropoffs that don't really make it harder, just scarier. I dunno. If a full size Hummer can do it which many seem able based on pictures I don't see why a qualified driver in an adequate full size truck couldn't also (meaning some skills and good tires, obviously 4wd with low range - better yet with lockers and swaybars disconnected).
Years ago I had a mildly modded Xterra and there were a lot of guys with similar rigs from CO who ran it successfully. My current truck isn't as good offroad just from a size and weight standpoint, but it does have some advantages with bigger tires, more torque and solid axles on both ends compared to my old X.
Plain and simple - the guys behind you will push you off the road after you take 30 minutes to one switch back - some jeeps take 5+ minutes to make the turn. Tight - and Narrow - SEE HERE
If you decide to go in a regular Pick Up let us all know - so as to not be there waiting on YOU.
Ya, that's all the descent west of the summit. I am talking about going up to the pass and then heading back to 550, without heading further west to puckerland.
This is a GM streetview of that spot:
https://goo.gl/maps/rCkr8c9ocVx
Another view of that step from above:
![[image]](http://www.off-road.com/images/content/3-Black-Bear-Trail-Colorado-Off-Road-11-9-16.jpg)
After that set of switchbacks the road over Black Bear Pass to Ingram Basin looks open and relatively straight.
http://www.off-road.com/trails-events/tr........the-infamous-black-bear-trail-54560.html
From this description it sounds like backtracking from the pass would be going against traffic, which may be too heavy to do it politely.
* This post was edited 11/17/17 02:06pm by paulj *
paulj wrote:
On the climb from 550 to the pass itself, there's one switchback where I'd turn around if I didn't have good ground clearance or traction.
This is a GM streetview of that spot:
https://goo.gl/maps/rCkr8c9ocVx
Yeah, just look at that picture. Not really anything very scenic to see up that road. Flowers, cliffs, waterfalls. Just the usual Colorado scenery. Hardly worth the hassle! On the climb from 550 to the pass itself, there's one switchback where I'd turn around if I didn't have good ground clearance or traction.
This is a GM streetview of that spot:
https://goo.gl/maps/rCkr8c9ocVx
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About 20 minutes in there is a vehicle heading back from the top of the stairsteps. Whether I rent a ride from one of the locals or not, I am really wanting to go there.
The road is a 2 way only from the bottom to the waterfall which is before those switchbacks.
I've driven it a number of times with our 4 wheel drive club in the Wrangler we once had and also with our Cherokee. Even with these vehicles with highly modified suspensions, traction aids, and tight turning steering that trip down and through the switchbacks is no cake walk. Pictures never fully convey what it's really like once you're on some of these roads out here.
Even if one has many years of experience offroading, those switchbacks will test your nerves. Some of those corners are off camber and can lift a tire through the turn. You try to do a multipoint turn to get around a corner and while you're mashing the brake pedal to the floor, the vehicle can continue to slide through a steep, loose corner. There's a reason so many people die trying to come down that road.
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Don't remember it being THAT narrow.
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4runnerguy wrote:
Just out of curiosity I did a search on Black Bear Pass and came up with this image :
Don't remember it being THAT narrow.
Just out of curiosity I did a search on Black Bear Pass and came up with this image
:Don't remember it being THAT narrow.
Not even close to that narrow nor that rocky. Did it in a long bed Dodge pickup and had no problem.
4runnerguy wrote:
Just out of curiosity I did a search on Black Bear Pass and came up with this image :
Don't remember it being THAT narrow.
Just out of curiosity I did a search on Black Bear Pass and came up with this image
:Don't remember it being THAT narrow.
He's doing it in Reverse Right!
Here's the story (you might get a kick out of it).
Here are photos from just off Hwy 550 up to the pass. A bit narrow in places. Maybe a three point turn on that one switch back spoken of before. I don't recall any clearance concerns for the segment you're talking. Overall there's plenty of width.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/fnOv0k6.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/ASZs1y1.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/kFd2zQL.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/Zb5U5j9.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/APJgxfb.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/XTsWbox.jpg)
This is just below that switchback.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/okRl0l0.jpg)
You can see far enough to pull over in a wide spot if oncoming traffic.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/rAMLwUx.jpg)
This is just an adrenaline moment.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/G6txk1Y.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/NfLquwv.jpg)
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/39DmysD.jpg)
Plenty of room to turn around at the top. Beautiful scenery.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/ly1f11o.jpg)
Not very far beyond the pass is this view, where you start to descend onto the Telluride side, WELL before the one way road and the VERY tight switchbacks above Telluride where the road's real reputation takes over.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/dka0vmQ.jpg)
And again, much later after the above view you come to this sign.
![[image]](https://i.imgur.com/90tNpBl.jpg)
Read the story. It will provide a little more insight on this segment you want to do - if I remember correctly. Just think smart, and I'd suggest a bit of tire pressure air-down. Just make sure not to air-down to where your later pavement run suffers. But high pressure (mileage improving) tires will be like marbles on marbles with that loose rock road. Much better to let the rubber compress and form around the road rocks a little. Just don't want low tires back on the pavement so there's a balance to consider.
Dave Pete wrote:
I think you'd be just fine. It's the same question we had, because we got to the starting point late in the day and were more concerned about "the unknown and discomfort" than anything else. We had the turn-around ace up our sleeve right up until we got to the latter switchbacks.
Here's the story (you might get a kick out of it).
Here are photos from just off Hwy 550 up to the pass. A bit narrow in places. Maybe a three point turn on that one switch back spoken of before. I don't recall any clearance concerns for the segment you're talking. Overall there's plenty of width.
This is just below that switchback.
You can see far enough to pull over in a wide spot if oncoming traffic.
This is just an adrenaline moment.
Plenty of room to turn around at the top. Beautiful scenery.
Not very far beyond the pass is this view, where you start to descend onto the Telluride side, WELL before the one way road and the VERY tight switchbacks above Telluride where the road's real reputation takes over.
And again, much later after the above view you come to this sign.
Read the story. It will provide a little more insight on this segment you want to do - if I remember correctly. Just think smart, and I'd suggest a bit of tire pressure air-down. Just make sure not to air-down to where your later pavement run suffers. But high pressure (mileage improving) tires will be like marbles on marbles with that loose rock road. Much better to let the rubber compress and form around the road rocks a little. Just don't want low tires back on the pavement so there's a balance to consider.
I think you'd be just fine. It's the same question we had, because we got to the starting point late in the day and were more concerned about "the unknown and discomfort" than anything else. We had the turn-around ace up our sleeve right up until we got to the latter switchbacks.
Here's the story (you might get a kick out of it).
Here are photos from just off Hwy 550 up to the pass. A bit narrow in places. Maybe a three point turn on that one switch back spoken of before. I don't recall any clearance concerns for the segment you're talking. Overall there's plenty of width.
This is just below that switchback.
You can see far enough to pull over in a wide spot if oncoming traffic.
This is just an adrenaline moment.
Plenty of room to turn around at the top. Beautiful scenery.
Not very far beyond the pass is this view, where you start to descend onto the Telluride side, WELL before the one way road and the VERY tight switchbacks above Telluride where the road's real reputation takes over.
And again, much later after the above view you come to this sign.
Read the story. It will provide a little more insight on this segment you want to do - if I remember correctly. Just think smart, and I'd suggest a bit of tire pressure air-down. Just make sure not to air-down to where your later pavement run suffers. But high pressure (mileage improving) tires will be like marbles on marbles with that loose rock road. Much better to let the rubber compress and form around the road rocks a little. Just don't want low tires back on the pavement so there's a balance to consider.
Those are the IMAGES of Colorado..............
Thanks for sharing,