Coast Resorts Open Roads Forum: Towing: Here we go, another EZ lube debate!

Print | Close

Topic: Here we go, another EZ lube debate!

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/08/17 01:16pm

I am the owner of a 2011 Keystone Sprinter with EZ lube hubs. I have been using the zerk fitting for annual greasing using a manual gun for 5 years. I also perform annual manual brake adjustments. Spring is here and I am getting ready to pull the hubs for a brake/bearing inspection for the first time. The question is - will I find my brake assembly coated in grease? Or will the brakes be clean and grease free?

I know I have noticed significant decline in my braking strength over the last couple years but have no knowledge yet as to why. I will post my results in a couple weeks. Hopefully with pics. I have no pony in this race, so am not prejudging the result one way or the other.

What do you think I will find? Place your bets!!!

2011 Keystone Sprinter 311BHS
2004 Suburban 2500 8.1L 4.10
Reese dual cam WDH
Tekonsha Prodigy 2

Posted By: BB_TX on 03/08/17 01:25pm

I use the EZ Lube system with no problem on my '07 5er. A couple years ago I noticed my brakes not working as well. They are manual adjust. A quick adjustment and they work fine.

Posted By: TucsonJim on 03/08/17 01:27pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

How many miles do you have on it?

2016 Ford F350 Turbo Diesel SRW 4x4
2017 Grand Design Reflection 297RSTS
2013 Ford F350 Turbo Diesel SRW 4x4 (Destroyed by fire - 8/29/16)
2014 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS (Destroyed by fire - 8/29/16)

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/08/17 01:30pm

My best guess would be about 20-25K.

Posted By: TucsonJim on 03/08/17 01:46pm

My prediction is that you won't have any grease in the brake chamber, but the brakes will be worn enough that they'll need replacing.

Posted By: 12th Man Fan on 03/08/17 01:48pm

I used the EZ lube zerts on my RV last summer. I did it by the book and I had one seal leak. Just got through replacing it.

Fortunately I have disc brakes and they were not compromised. I cold see the grease on one of my level up jacks is what got me to looking.

Although I am a little disappointed about the failure I am still going to use this method to grease my bearings because I can see my seals without removing the wheels.

If you have the drum brakes a little extra caution is justified in my mind.

2014 GMC Duramax 4X4 DRW Crew

2015 DRV Tradition

Posted By: 7and7 on 03/08/17 02:43pm

I believe the main thing that blows the seals out is pumping the grease in to fast. A typical grease gun can develop 1200 psi. Take your time.

Posted By: MWJones on 03/08/17 03:27pm

I am interested in the result. Post it here not in a new thread.

M Jones
American and Texan by birth
Christian by the Grace of God
Retired and enjoying Traveling and Camping
Spending part of summers in South Fork, Co

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/08/17 03:53pm

Will do.

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/08/17 05:22pm

I have a 2010 Fuzion and pulled the hubs for the first time last year and had no grease anywhere except where it was supposed to be. I've used the EZ Lube several times over the years. I had noticed some loss of braking power too, and it was much improved after I put everything back together and readjusted the brake shoes' clearances. Probably have in the neighborhood of 20,000 miles, maybe more, I've never kept track.

But be prepared, and go over the hub surfaces where the seal lip rides. I notice on mine there were several nicks and, not quite, gouges near to the area where the seal lip rides. Personally I think the lousy assembly of these units is one of the causes of grease leaks.

* This post was edited 03/08/17 05:30pm by fj12ryder *

Howard and Peggy

"Don't Panic"

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/09/17 09:05am

I coated the seal lip and surface on the spindle with grease before sliding the hub back in place. I did run my ringer all around the spindle to make sure there were no burrs.

2015 RAM LongHorn 3500 Dually CrewCab 4X4 CUMMINS/AISIN RearAir 385HP/865TQ 4:10's
37,800# GCVWR "Towing Beast"

"HeavyWeight" B&W RVK3600

2016 MobileSuites 39TKSB3 highly "Elited" In the stable

2007.5 Mobile Suites 36 SB3 29,000# Combined SOLD

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/09/17 09:09am

^^^^^That's something that should be done for sure.

Posted By: aftermath on 03/09/17 10:26am

I am not a fan of bearing buddies, which I believe to be the same sort of thing we are talking about.

I recently re-purchased an older tent trailer that I had owned from 1989 to 2005. One of the more recent owners installed bearing buddies and then began to pump grease into them. When I jacked up the trailer to grease and inspect the bearings I could not get the wheel off of the trailer. The new caps with zerts did not allow enough clearance between the axle and the body. I had to knock them off to get the wheel off. Upon inspection there was grease all over the brake shoes and everything else.

I believe that the owner thought he was doing the right thing but pumping grease under pressure damaged the seals and let the stuff out. It was quite a sight. If you have a boat trailer that goes under water regularly the bearing buddy makes sense as long as you don't overdo it. On a regular trailer bearing and brake shoes need to be inspected every year, based on mileage of course.

2017 Toyota Tundra, Double Cab, 5.7L V8
2006 Airstream 25 FB SE
Equalizer Hitch

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 01:40pm

The results are in!!!!

Just going to wait to share them a little bit for dramatic effect. And to let those who want to weigh in on a prediction.

Posted By: shelbyfv on 03/09/17 02:57pm

Please just get on with it.

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 03:29pm

OK. Its disappointing, but yes, the first drum I pulled shows obvious grease contamination throughout the brake assembly. Though I first indicated that I had no stake in the outcome, I now realize that I would have much preferred that the EZ lube procedure did not result in grease leaks. It would be much nicer to continue greasing the easy way via the zerk fitting.

I am not posting this to demand anyone else approach their maintenance in any specific way. There is to much of that around already. But I did think it would be useful to others to share MY OWN personal experience. Take it or leave it.

I know this for certain. I will NEVER again grease using EZ lube. Hand packing is the only remaining option for me.

* This post was edited 03/10/17 05:16am by js6343js6343 *

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 03:31pm

I have pictures but not sure how I post them......

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/09/17 03:52pm

Bummer for that to have happened, but it's certainly possible.

Posted By: BarneyS on 03/09/17 04:07pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

I have pictures but not sure how I post them......

Look at this thread, which is stuck at the top of the DIY forum, for an easy way to post pictures into your thread. [emoticon]

All you do is
1. Upload your picture
2. Copy the resulting URL
3. Paste that URL into your post with NO modifications.

The picture will then appear in your post and be properly sized for use in our forums.
Barney

2004 Sunnybrook Titan 30FKS TT
Hensley "Arrow" 1400# hitch (Sold)
Not towing now.
Former tow vehicles were 2016 Ram 2500 CTD, 2002 Ford F250, 7.3 PSD, 1997 Ram 2500 5.9 gas engine

Posted By: mowermech on 03/09/17 04:13pm

aftermath wrote:

Actually, the "Bearing Buddy" for boat trailers is an entirely different thing than "E-Z-Lube" hubs.
The "Bearing Buddy" is a spring loaded dust cap that holds pressure on the grease to help prevent cold water from being sucked past the seal. It is not intended to be an easy method of lubing bearings, and does not have a relief function to keep from blowing the seal out of the hub. When used improperly, blowing the seal is inevitable.
The "E-Z-Lube" axle, however, has a grease passage drilled through the spindle, which allows the grease to exit between the inner bearing and the seal. When the grease is pumped slowly, while spinning the wheel, the grease flows through the bearings and out the hub. This flushes the old/dirty grease out, effectively repacking the bearings. Using a high pressure grease gun, pumping too fast, and/or failing to spin the wheel can blow the seal, resulting in contaminating the brakes.
Both systems will do their jobs as intended, if used properly. Following the instructions is highly recommended.

CM1, USN (RET)
2017 Jayco TT
Daily Driver: '14 Subaru Outback
1998 Dodge QC LWB, Cummins, 5 speed, 4X2
2 Kawasaki Brute Force 750 ATVs.
Pride Raptor 3 wheeled off-road capable mobility scooter
"When seconds count, help is only minutes away!"

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 05:29pm

Hopefully this picture will post. It shows grease boogers all over the edges of the shoes. You can see grease pretty much everywhere.

[image]

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 05:32pm

Here is another picture of the inside of the hub. You can see where a lot of grease made it past the seal onto the hub. Hopefully I can clean that hub with brake cleaner and reuse it. I see no reason why not, but I heard someone once say that grease can absorb into the metal. That seems crazy to me.

[image]

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 05:37pm

A close up of the spindle behind the inside bearing. Grease all over.....

[image]

Posted By: Ron3rd on 03/09/17 05:53pm

aftermath wrote:

Bearing Buddy is completely different and generally used for boats.

2016 6.7 CTD 2500 BIG HORN MEGA CAB
2013 Forest River 3001W Windjammer
Equilizer Hitch
Honda EU2000

"I have this plan to live forever; so far my plan is working"

Posted By: moresmoke on 03/09/17 07:04pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

Thats not actually that bad. I have had wheel seals leak that much on axles without ez lube. Unfortunately the single lip seals used on trailer axles are not that great.

Your hub/drum will easily clean up with brakleen.

Its not often you find a brake drum that is so contaminated that it can't be washed out well enough to use.

Trailer brake shoes are cheap enough that they can be changed.

Back in the day when parts were expensive and labor was cheap, we used to burn the oil out of semi brake linings with a torch. Talk about a smoky dirty job.

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/09/17 07:24pm

Yeah, hubs can be cleaned up good but the shoes should be replaced if they got grease contaminated.

Posted By: JBarca on 03/09/17 07:30pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

I know one this for certain. I will NEVER again grease using EZ lube. Hand packing is the only remaining option for me.

Hi,

Just asking and not trying to change your mind. While I have EZ lube axles I also hand pack.

2 Questions:

1. When you greased, did you jack the camper up, spin the wheel by hand when you where "slowly" pumping the grease in?

2. Did you notice if the old seal had garter spring on the inside of it?

Both of these questions are out of pure curiosity only. The 1st question is a debate on the instructions, to jack up and spin or not.

The 2nd question deals with the darn cheap 1 lip seal that they actually sell and can be put in by accident on a brake axle verse the double lip seal with the garter spring. If they did this, and you had a single lip seal, you where hosed from day one.

Thanks for your post. My first set of axles on this camper was non EZ lube. When I bought the new axles to correct an alignment issue, I added the EZ lube feature, but again still do not use it. This was what I found on the "standard" lube axle.
[image]

Some of this "might" come from trailer inspections in states that require you to pull a wheel. If that inspectors did a quick pull and look and put the drum back on, they can nick the seal and you have a mess even on the standard seals. For the price of the seal, change it every time the wheel is pulled. The odds are not in your favor to reuse the old seal. If the inspection is going to pull the drum, they should change the seal. And yes they may need to charge you for it but it is better then a seal failure.

PS. I have also upgraded to the Dexter self adjusting brakes. As long as your brakes drums run true, they work well.

Thanks

John

John & Cindy

2005 Ford F350 Super Duty, 4x4; 6.8L V10 with 4.10
CC, SB, Lariat & FX4 package
21,000 GCWR, 11,000 GVWR
Ford Tow Command
1,700# Reese HP hitch & HP Dual Cam
2 1/2" Towbeast Receiver

2004 Sunline Solaris T310SR
(I wish we were camping!)

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 08:01pm

Quote:

1. When you greased, did you jack the camper up, spin the wheel by hand when you where "slowly" pumping the grease in?

2. Did you notice if the old seal had garter spring on the inside of it?

I think the first year I pumped in grease without jacking it up. Years 2 through 5, I did jack it up and turn the wheel as I greased. I am not exactly sure how slowly I pumped the grease in but it was a manual gun so I think I was doing it OK. But who knows. I am no expert at this stuff.

I dont even know what a garter spring is. [emoticon]

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/09/17 08:04pm

I guess I will check to see if I have a double lip or single lip seal when I pull the inner bearing tomorrow.

Posted By: LarryJM on 03/10/17 02:56am

JBarca wrote:

EXACTLY and if I'm not mistakened those grease seals are really not reusable and should be replaced any time you pull a drum so that is IMO something to consider. I also dislike the EZ-lube feature because of the excessive grease it takes to "prime" the system and I'm in the camp that yearly inspections are generally not needed and I think about every 2 to 5 years and around 15 to 20K miles is more reasonable for brake service where you have to pull the drums.

I too upgraded recently to the self adjusting brakes and they seem a good investment. I bought the entire brake package with backing plate and reused just my old drums.

Larry

2001 standard box 7.3L E-350 PSD Van with 4.10 rear and 2007 Holiday Rambler Aluma-Lite 8306S Been RV'ing since 1974.
RAINKAP INSTALL////ETERNABOND INSTALL

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 04:45am

Just as an FYI. In my case, I have never pulled these hubs prior to yesterday. My state does not require inspections. Or if they do, I am not aware of it.

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/10/17 07:54am

js6343js6343 wrote:

Didn't you say you went 5 years without inspecting the seals? Hand packed or properly greased EZ Lube both could have looked the same.

I can't remember did you ever adjust the bearings? Reason I ask is if the bearings are out of adjustment that can cause seal wear.

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 11:43am

Yes. I did not replace the seals until yesterday. The whole premise of this admittedly unscientific experiment, is what would the result be of using ez lube as a greasing method exclusive of anything else. (for a period of 5 years) In my own case it did not work out.

I did not perform any adjustments to the bearings. Nor have the drums ever been removed until yesterday. (since the factory)

I make no claim one way or the other about the appropriateness of any specific approach. I am just sharing what I did and what the result was.

Posted By: JBarca on 03/10/17 11:47am

js6343js6343 wrote:

I guess I will check to see if I have a double lip or single lip seal when I pull the inner bearing tomorrow.

Here are some pics of a single and double lip seal with the garter spring used in trailer axles.

The double has this spring energizing a sealing lip against the shaft. There is also a single wiper seal in front of it as the first line of defense against dirt etc.

[image]

Here is a cross section chart. The double used in trailers looks like the lip design TB2
[image]

Here is anther image of a double lip seal with spring. This is from SKF, a big name in the industrial world
[image]

The single seal, looks something like this. I cannot find on the web easily the exact single seal used in trailer axles use but this is close. No spring, just a flexible wiper to help keep dirt out. The outer casing is different then shown in this pic
[image]

The spring design adds a great amount of benefit as it keeps the sealing lip engaged against the shaft and helps with an level of internal pressure blow by and external pressure pushing dirt in.

The cost between the trailer axle double and single is pennies, yet they still sell the single and install them on non brake axles. This comes back to making thousands of axles as a cost point you can save funds. The end user I'm sure would be glad to pay the difference if they knew about it.

Basically, look to see if the spring is in your seal. That is a first tell tale sign.

Hope this helps

John

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 11:51am

Yep. I see the spring!! Looks like the factory installed double lip.

Thanks for the info.

Posted By: JBarca on 03/10/17 12:04pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

Just as an FYI. In my case, I have never pulled these hubs prior to yesterday. My state does not require inspections. Or if they do, I am not aware of it.

Thanks for clarifying and about jacking up the camper. The setup is limited.

Even the double seal used on the trailer axles are inexpensive and not the best out there. There are seals built that will hold the grease pressure, but the cost is orders of magnitude higher. Even the generic ones might be $50 ea. while the top of the line brands can be $100 to $150 each. Hydraulics holds thousands of PSI every day and live in dirt on an excavator or back hoe etc. We most likely would probably have a hard time paying, $200 plus for 4 grease seals. So we get what they give us, an inexpensive seal that gets us by for the most part. And the axle manuals tell us to check annually.

Since I do the hand pack myself I know what I have. I go 2 to 3 years before the next repack and change out the seals. Since doing this practice I have not had a double seal failure and my state does not require annual trailer inspections. The self adjusting brakes help too and when I pull the drums I measure the lining thickness and track mileage to help know when to buy new brake plate assemblies. In my case, I have kept my camper long enough to track this. For folks changing campers every 5 to 7 years, well they may only have 2 wheel bearing repacks in the life they had the camper.

It seems from your observations, 5 years may be the limit on the seal life and that is too long. The seals do wear, just look at the wiper point from new to old. From your post, we at least a one data point to not go beyond.

Thanks

John

* This post was edited 03/10/17 12:38pm by JBarca *

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 12:11pm

John,

Great feedback. I think I am going to follow your lead from here on out. Hand pack every 2-3 years. Probably 3 since I seldom get around to everything else that needs to get done around here....

[emoticon]

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 12:21pm

Just a random thought. I had NO IDEA how much maintenance work I was signing up for when I bought this camper.

I just thought it would be fun to go camping!

[emoticon]

Posted By: JBarca on 03/10/17 12:32pm

I'll pass along something I heard from Dexter about the EAZ lube axles and how this all came about on campers.

The EAZ lube was made originally for the boat trailer industry where they submerged the axles. The RV and general trailer industry has a very long history of axle and bearing failure due to lack of lubrication. In an attempt to help the axles get some level of grease on a periodic basis they started offering the EAZ lube to the RV world. RV manufactures are always looking for an edge on the competition and the cost to create the EAZ lube axle from a standard axle is not much cost. So a "feature" is added to the camper to help make their brand better and help the axle from having a better chance of getting greased. So there you have it or at least one hot line phone techs opinion that passed it along.

So in all this, the poor axles suffer lack of service many times due to the owner never knowing they are doing something wrong by not doing routine axle care. If they see a grease fitting, it might spark an idea they need to grease it.... We don't go and put grease in the front wheel bearings of autos every year, why is a TT any different???

A lot of this is education of the RV'er and how do they get it?

When we bought our first 2 campers brand new, the PDI contained a lot about how to use the inside features of the camper. How to start the oven, the furnace, the AC unit, how to put up and take down the awning Etc. By our 3rd camper, we did our own PDI and I was the one inspecting it.

On the 2 new campers we bought during the dealer PDI, they never talked about that the brakes need to be manually adjusted every 2,000 to 3,000 miles, the bearings have to be packed and you really better do the first repack soon. And that the cheap nylon spring bushings wear out in short order, to checking lug nuts torque after changing a tire (many TT's now have a sticker for this at least) or you had better get up on the roof and check that caulking 4 times a year and deal with those little tiny splits in the caulking or your roof will leak. Loading the camper properly for weight and balance and tire care. And don't get me started on the WD hitch....

Yes, all this is in the manuals and we should "all" have known better. But it would sure help if you could get a hint to go look at these things which can leave you stranded on the side of the road if they do not get routine attention. Maybe if we all knew what it takes to keep a camper running well a long time, we might not have bought one in the first place... Fortunately we really like camping and I like working on the camper and the truck. It is for sure a labor of love...

Posted By: JBarca on 03/10/17 12:37pm

js6343js6343 wrote:

Just a random thought. I had NO IDEA how much maintenance work I was signing up for when I bought this camper.

I just thought it would be fun to go camping!

[emoticon]

Now that's funny... [emoticon]

You and me both...

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/10/17 01:23pm

JBarca,

I could not have said it better. They dont talk about any of this at the RV shows. I probably would not have bought one if I knew. But the kids will have good memories and I have it now.

After I get these brakes dealt with, I have a major roof separation to deal with, then on to the awning....

Posted By: Dave H M on 03/12/17 07:32am

Thought I read through all the blog fairly well.

One thing I missed is if all the seals looked the same.

i saw where the first hub pulled was addressed in depth.

How did all the rest of the hubs look.

Now be honest. [emoticon]

Posted By: Tvov on 03/12/17 07:59am

JBarca wrote:

js6343js6343 wrote:

I guess I will check to see if I have a double lip or single lip seal when I pull the inner bearing tomorrow.

Here are some pics of a single and double lip seal with the garter spring used in trailer axles.

....(edited for size)

John

Thanks for that! Great pictures of different seals.

_________________________________________________________
2021 F150 2.7
2004 21' Forest River Surveyor

Posted By: js6343js6343 on 03/12/17 03:06pm

Dave H M wrote:

It got cold again in Chicago, so I have not had the opportunity to pull the other 3 hubs. I will make sure to post the results when I have the chance. I really have no bias in the outcome, so I will report back accurately. If the other 3 hubs are clean, great. If not, that is OK to. Either way, I (personally) am not taking any more chances. No more EZ Lube for me.

Posted By: Hybridhunter on 03/17/17 06:44pm

Same experience for me, but I don't bother doing anything more than a visual inspection, and brake adjustment..... I don't repack or grease the bearings on any of my other road vehicles.... No wheels fly off, brakes work fine. I used to "meticulously maintain" the bearings and axles. It does more damage than good, other than those who tear them apart every year and do the whole enchilada, which in my opinion is not necessary.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/18/17 08:10am

Hybridhunter wrote:

Some of us do want to look for things like this:

[image]

Good Luck

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/18/17 08:10am

Hybridhunter wrote:

Some of us do want to look for things like this:

[image]

Good Luck

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/18/17 09:47am

I will be pulling mine this Summer after two years of use. I will be buying the BEST quality seals available. I will clean the bearings and remove all old grease. If the bearings look good I will grease annually and while suspended check for proper adjustment. If the adjustment feels good I will keep greasing for several years after.

If there is any sign of wear I will just change to Timkins. I am running 17,500# on the two axles.

I replaced the wheel bearings on the rear of my VW PU at about 300K and over 300K on my 86 C20's front. Proper grease and adjustment wheel bearings will last a LONG time. I have always used AMZ/OIL grease.

Posted By: deltabravo on 03/18/17 10:19am

It's a high likelihood that eventually the volume of grease pumped in to the zerk over several years will surpass the capacity of the bearing cavity, blowing out the rear seal.

Previous owner of my cargo trailer followed the "there's a grease fitting, so I will shoot grease in it every year" maintenance regime.
It blew out the rear seal:

Upgrades to my trailer - 8.5x20 Haulmark

2009 Silverado 3500HD Dually, D/A, CCLB 4x4 (bought new 8/30/09)
2018 Arctic Fox 992 with an Onan 2500i "quiet" model generator

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/18/17 12:15pm

The problem is the cheap Chinese wheel bearings. The bearing I posted above was used for 8 months and 11,000 miles. Four of the eight bearings exhibited similar wear on several rollers each. A fifth bearing was failing because of a ridge on the inner race. They had the recommended Valvoline wheel bearing grease. The angles and finishes were not to print and I am sure that the steel was poor quality as well. Had I not checked them, complete failure was sure to happen soon.

My 38 year old van has the original bearings and I just cleaned and greased them for the third time. Of course they are quality bearings made in the USA.

Posted By: JBarca on 03/18/17 08:15pm

Lynnmor wrote:

The problem is the cheap wheel bearings.

My 38 year old van has the original bearings and I just cleaned and greased them for the third time. Of course they are quality bearings made in the USA.

Bingo!!! The tapered roller bearing has been around a good long time. Applied right, made right, adjusted right, lubed right they are close to indestructibly. It's sad to see how junk parts get in the mix on such a critical well documented part. OK, so we have to pay for the quality, so be it. You have an axle failure on the road, it will pay for a whole lot of better parts fast. The quality on the seals are not great either. But again it comes back to cost.

Posted By: wnjj on 03/18/17 11:36pm

deltabravo wrote:

I thought the point was to expel the old grease and cavity isn't sealed. Pumping too fast and without spinning the wheel is the issue.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/19/17 08:40am

wnjj wrote:

I thought the point was to expel the old grease and cavity isn't sealed. Pumping too fast and without spinning the wheel is the issue.

To expel the old grease, you would have to pump a massive quantity of grease in. All the grease from behind inner bearing, in the cavity between the bearings and the grease in the outer bearing would have to be flushed out the front. If you don't get it all, (and you won't), there will be old grease from the inner bearing now in the outer bearing. I suggest just doing it right when you do the annual bearing inspection and forget the useless and troublesome grease fitting.

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/19/17 09:40am

deltabravo wrote:

Not sure you understand how the EZ lube works. The center cavity fills BEFORE the outer bearing does then it comes out the outer edge of the bearing.

Did you have eZ lube or Bearing buddies?

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/19/17 09:41am

Lynnmor wrote:

I agree! that is why I will be pulling mine this Summer to inspect and very possibly will be replacing the bearings with Timken's.

Posted By: aftermath on 03/19/17 09:47am

deltabravo wrote:

This is it! When people see a zert they simply pump grease into it. Pretty easy to do the "right" thing. I personally know very little about the EZ lube set up. I do know how a bearing buddy works. The problem I have with both of these is that most (not all) folks out there know very little about how to properly use the fitting to avoid blowing out the seals. If you purchase a trailer from a second owner chances are that your brakes will look like those in the photos posted.

With brakes, I believe they need to be inspected and adjusted yearly. If you are going to do this, then pack the bearings while you are in there.

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/19/17 10:01am

^^^^^^Do you pull the brakes on your car/truck yearly? They generally get a lot more use than the trailer. Some inspection ideas have merit, and others not so much.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/19/17 02:43pm

fj12ryder wrote:

^^^^^^Do you pull the brakes on your car/truck yearly? They generally get a lot more use than the trailer. Some inspection ideas have merit, and others not so much.

Yes, it's the law in PA. I'm sure glad that I found those bad bearings way before the state inspection was due.

Posted By: fj12ryder on 03/19/17 02:59pm

Yeah, you're supposed to have your brakes inspected in Missouri too, but they generally only pull one wheel, and it's the wheel with the disc, and not a drum. I've never had a drum brake wheel pulled. And let's be realistic: it's for revenue generation, safety is a secondary concern.

Those bad bearings were on your car/truck? Highly unusual.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/19/17 04:27pm

They were new bearings purchased from eTrailer that were included with new Dexter drums and used on a travel trailer. They were a cheap Chinese brand that is also found on new trailers.

In PA, one brake on each axle is inspected. I hate inspections because of the many problems caused, not cured, by the inspectors. But I guess it is a necessary evil because so many would drive junk.

Posted By: trail-explorer on 03/20/17 11:40am

Lynnmor wrote:

I suggest just doing it right when you do the annual bearing inspection and forget the useless and troublesome grease fitting.

Ditto.

There really is no need to continually pump new grease in the fitting. The grease that is in there doesn't get out (or go away). Do periodic dissemble, clean/inspect, repack the bearings, all is good.
Then go camping.

Bob

Posted By: aftermath on 03/20/17 09:18pm

fj12ryder wrote:

^^^^^^Do you pull the brakes on your car/truck yearly? They generally get a lot more use than the trailer. Some inspection ideas have merit, and others not so much.

Uh, not always. When I got my Airstream I asked the mechanic about yearly inspections and he told me you should go by mileage more than just a calendar. He mentioned 10k miles. I have been averaging close to 8K a year so, no I don't do it yearly. Some years yes, other years it is more like a year and a half.

Good catch.

Posted By: time2roll on 03/20/17 09:53pm

Just pulled my drums after 10 years. Maybe 30,000 to 50,000 miles.
My cheapo China bearings looked perfect.
Mobil 1 grease still had the original red color.
I will check them again in 10 more.

2001 F150 SuperCrew
2006 Keystone Springdale 249FWBHLS
675w Solar pictures back up

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/21/17 07:10am

time2roll wrote:

Just pulled my drums after 10 years. Maybe 30,000 to 50,000 miles.
My cheapo China bearings looked perfect.
Mobil 1 grease still had the original red color.
I will check them again in 10 more.

Hope you replaced the seals after that much time.

Posted By: Dave H M on 03/21/17 05:54pm

I an with timetoroll, i just done mine at the 7 year mark. got jumpy due to all the hype.

things were good to go, put it back together and don't know when I will do that nut roll again. [emoticon]

Posted By: time2roll on 03/21/17 07:04pm

Cummins12V98 wrote:

Hope you replaced the seals after that much time.

I decided to go disk was the primary reason I pulled it apart.
Cap, nut and washer is the only parts I kept.
For the annual inspections I saved... paid for the full set-up.

Posted By: Hannibal on 03/22/17 04:54pm

I think some of you fellers aren't familiar with the EZ-Lube axles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT0RKDGgDm8

2020 F250 STX CC SB 7.3L 10spd 3.55 4x4
2010 F250 XLT CC SB 5.4L 5spdTS 3.73
ex '95 Cummins,'98 12v Cummins,'01.5 Cummins,'03 Cummins; '05 Hemi
2017 Jayco 28RLS TT 32.5'

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/23/17 06:54am

Hannibal wrote:

I think some of you fellers aren't familiar with the EZ-Lube axles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT0RKDGgDm8

Good video! Notice he said "MANUAL" grease gun.

Posted By: Hannibal on 03/23/17 03:40pm

Cummins12V98 wrote:

Hannibal wrote:

I think some of you fellers aren't familiar with the EZ-Lube axles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT0RKDGgDm8

Good video! Notice he said "MANUAL" grease gun.

Absolutely do not use a pneumatic grease gun for wheel bearings or ball joints for that matter. And if you feel more than just a little bit of resistance, stop and figure out why. Make sure your grease is compatible with the existing grease as well.

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 03/24/17 06:53am

Hannibal wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

Hannibal wrote:

I think some of you fellers aren't familiar with the EZ-Lube axles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XT0RKDGgDm8

Good video! Notice he said "MANUAL" grease gun.

So true, when pumping grease into my MC trailers EZ Lubes I did not really feel much if any difference once the cavity was filled.

Posted By: myredracer on 03/24/17 12:07pm

Our bearing story: Our dealer pumped in grease during the PDI (head tech said they do that on all PDIs) which caused grease to get onto the brakes. After one season while in for some misc. warranty work, I asked them to take the drums off and inspect the bearings and brakes and they said the seals had blown and had leaked grease. They wanted to charge us $1K to fix it (!!). I called Alko and said they would make sure they would cover the cost and would work it out with the dealer. Got our TT back and assumed they replaced the seals and put it all back together properly.

The following season, on the way back home I discovered one drum was running hotter than the rest. Took drums off to inspect bearings and brakes and found 2 colors of grease in there and grease on the brakes - clearly the dealer had not done anything and just slapped it back together (wouldn't be surprised if they submitted a claim for installing new seals & repack). I also found that the dealer had over-tightened the axle nuts - I needed a wrench to undo them. I replaced the cheap Ch*nese bearings with US made Timkens which a local supplier luckily had in stock. Went on a long road trip last summer through 7 states and zero issues with the new bearings and repack job I did myself.

Morale of story is, it's possible you could even have problems with your seals & bearings from day one due to what the dealer did. Just can't trust a dealer. From many threads I've read on EZ-lube axles, you just shouldn't use them and should remove, inspect and hand repack. You could always get a shop to do it for $200-300 or so.

If anyone thinks doing a bearing repack is a hassle, you should try replacing bearings... The bearing cup that is in the drums are extremely hard to remove because there is almost no protruding lip on the cup to get a drift onto.

Posted By: bluefishgary on 03/26/17 02:12am

Hi just to let you know that on my 3axle I did all the wheel bearing and replaced all seals. All the bearing looked great.one seal was seeping a little , but it did not get on brakes. I did use 6 cans on break clean, one for each wheel.Took my time cleaned and repack the hubs.Packed the bearing by hand.Start to finish may be 6 hrs total.
Now just to clean up

2019 Ford DRW C/C
2017 Vintage with living quarters 44'3 Axle
I caught a fish once -it was fun

Posted By: Dave H M on 03/26/17 07:55am

If anyone thinks doing a bearing repack is a hassle, you should try replacing bearings... The bearing cup that is in the drums are extremely hard to remove because there is almost no protruding lip on the cup to get a drift onto.

I just did four and did not have any problem. maybe your drift is too soft or more patience was in order.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 03/26/17 08:50am

Dave H M wrote:

Years ago, when common sense was still used, the hubs had notches for a punch. Now, many are built with little or no amount of the bearing cup exposed, therefore no place for a punch to engage it.

Some weld a bead on the cup so that it shrinks as it cools. Another method it to grind some notches in the hub that should have been there in the first place.

Posted By: myredracer on 03/26/17 11:08am

myredracer wrote:

Lynnmor wrote:

Dave H M wrote:

I just did four and did not have any problem. maybe your drift is too soft or more patience was in order.

Years ago, when common sense was still used, the hubs had notches for a punch. Now, many are built with little or no amount of the bearing cup exposed, therefore no place for a punch to engage it.

No, not at all an issue with the drift being too soft or lack of patience, it was as Lynnmor has pointed out, very little of the edge of the bearing cup being exposed. I ended up using a length of 1-1/2" pipe (or might have been 1") to get more contact with the almost non-existent lip on the cup. Cleaning & repacking bearings is easy peasy in comparison to replacing them and those who are mechanically inclined shouldn't shy away from doing it themselves.

When Alko was independently owned, their drums were marked "Axletek" and made in China for Alko but now that Dexter and Alko are combined, am not sure what drums you'll get. Our Alko axles (from early 2014) came with Dexter seals. Like many RV parts & components, there is little regard for making things easier to repair or maintain or to last longer.

Posted By: JKGoneHunting on 02/10/18 09:25pm

I’m a newly registered member here but have been a reader for quite a while. Most recently I was searching all over the web for a way to get the inner bearing races out of my hubs. Strangely, one of the Axle Teknology hubs on each of my 5,200 lb. Lippert axles has plenty of edge to drive the race on but the other hub on both axles has zero edge protruding. It looks like to me somebody at the foundry grabbed the wrong core for two of my hub castings or somebody at Lippert grabbed the wrong hubs.

I took the hubs to our old standby local auto machine shop thinking they would have the right tools to press the races out and they just shook their heads. They suggested the weld bead approach, but I didn’t really want to heat the casting too much in one area and I wanted a fix that would allow me to service the bearings anywhere between here and Alaska if necessary.

I decided to see if I could grind some undercuts behind the races with my trusty Dremel Tool. I was a little concerned about removing any material until I realized the other two hubs had 1/8” less material already, and they had the same outside diameter. Creating a stress riser was another minor concern, but a generous radius with all the edges rounded off would not be an issue. Since it worked out so well and took much less time than all my fretting over it (confession: I’m a retired engineer…) I thought I should share.

[image]

While it looks like there might be an edge there, that corner of the race is nicely radiused and nothing would stay on it, no matter what kind of edge I ground on the punch.

Just to make sure material removal didn’t cause an issue, I ground the undercuts adjacent to two opposite lug studs where there is a huge boss of cast material outside the bearing race area.

[image]

I used a 5/8” diameter by 3/8” long grinding wheel at 20,000 RPM. I “dressed” the wheel a few times by grinding on a junk bearing race. Each undercut took less than 5 minutes.

[image]

Now, after deburring the shoulder the race stops against, cleaning up the grind swarf and reassembly, my bearings can be changed with the tools I carry in the truck all the time.

My $.02 worth on the EZ Lube debate… I bought my trailer used with very few miles on it. I can’t even measure the brake shoe wear. The dealer said they “checked the wheel bearings.” One bearing sounded rough and when I got inside them, two brake assemblies were full of grease. The other bearings (Chinese) had scratches in the races I could pick up with my fingernail so I replaced all the bearings with Timkens. (My fingernail is still calibrated from many years in the hydraulics industry.) I want a fresh start. I will not use the EZ Lube feature due to the brakes. I will check the bearings for endplay and noise and repack them by hand next winter. If the bearings look good I’ll probably go to a repack schedule of 3 years or 12k miles, or before any very long trip.

Thanks

* This post was last edited 02/10/18 09:47pm by JKGoneHunting *

2014 Ram 2500 Cummins, Hensley BD3 18k TrailerSaver
2011 Crossroads Cruiser 27RLX

Posted By: mike-s on 02/10/18 10:00pm

+1, good job. I'd have likely just Dremel'd the race and put a steel punch to it, making a note to get new brake hubs the next time.

Although, China.

Posted By: Ralph Cramden on 02/10/18 10:11pm

"EZ Lube" is Dexter. "Super Lube" is Lippert. Two different names/trademarks for what amounts to the same basic thing. What is different is Lippert uses/used the cheapest single lip seal they could find, and Dexter uses double lip seals. I say uses/used in Lipperts case because they may now be using double lip seals, after the fiasco they had with Grand Design. They had so many issues that Grand Design quit using their axles.

Posted By: Lynnmor on 02/11/18 12:05am

I'm glad that my suggestion on 3/26/17 was of use to someone. You did a fine job and that is exactly what I had in mind.

I agree with your maintenance schedule as well. The grease fittings have no place on any axle that will not be immersed in water. Since the spindles often have poor finishes and tolerances, it doesn't much matter if the seals are single or double lip, they both can leak.

Look at where the inner race contacts the shoulder on the spindle. You can check the contact area by using layout dye or a magic marker. 3500lb axles have little surface area and that leads to burrs and loss of bearing adjustment as the shoulder gets malformed. When a seal is pushed over the sharp edge, it is ruined as it is installed.

Posted By: dodge guy on 02/11/18 04:58am

Removing the drums every year or 2 would’ve shown you the leaks early on and you could’ve fixed it before it damaged the brakes. I’ve found mine a couple of times slinging a bit of grease. If I never pulled the drums it would’ve gotten worse.

You can’t do a brake inspection without removing the drums!

I just replaced my brake assemblies last year after 10 years and 20k miles. Still on the same drums and only replaced 2 wheel bearings due to early signs of wear.

Wife Kim
Son Brandon 17yrs
Daughter Marissa 16yrs
Dog Bailey

12 Forest River Georgetown 350TS Hellwig sway bars, BlueOx TrueCenter stabilizer

13 Ford Explorer Roadmaster Stowmaster 5000, VIP Tow>
A bad day camping is
better than a good day at work!

Posted By: JKGoneHunting on 02/11/18 08:14am

Thanks for the feedback guys. Red Lion’s point about seal damage during installation reminded me of another point I think is worth sharing about the EZ Lube style spindles. My 5,200 lb axles have a generous shoulder with a large chamfer to seat the inner race against so wear there has not been an issue. However, the cross-hole to supply grease between the inner bearing and the seal is centered on the shoulder. In my experience, this is a deburring nightmare! While the seal surface is obviously ground after the cross-holes are drilled, the edges of the holes on mine were still VERY sharp. I honed and sanded them all to get rid of any potential seal damage during installation.

The “better idea” of EZ Lube created a new potential failure mode of seal damage. I would imagine the deburring of the cross-holes is totally operator dependent and the operator drilling mine wasn’t having a very good day… If you have this kind of spindles, it would be a good idea to check for sharp edges at the cross-holes next time you inspect bearings.

Posted By: Bird Freak on 02/11/18 04:37pm

I have never understood why people think these are a good thing. You don't add grease to your wheel bearings on your car so why would you on a trailer?

Eddie
03 Fleetwood Pride, 36-5L
04 Ford F-250 Superduty
15K Pullrite Superglide
Old coach 04 Pace Arrow 37C with brakes sometimes.
Owner- The Toy Shop-
Auto Restoration and Customs 32 years. Retired by a stroke!
We love 56 T-Birds

Posted By: fj12ryder on 02/11/18 06:35pm

Bird Freak wrote:

I have never understood why people think these are a good thing. You don't add grease to your wheel bearings on your car so why would you on a trailer?

For the same reason people want to pull the wheels off and repack by hand every year or two.

On edit: added "every year or two"

* This post was edited 02/11/18 08:08pm by fj12ryder *

Posted By: carringb on 02/11/18 07:46pm

I have the AL-KO equivalent. Trailer brakes were non-existent by the time I got home. Brakes were completely soaked in grease. ORV doesn't grease them. Dealer said they didn't either. Maybe the delivery driver did? Or a new hire at the dealer. Anyways, ORV still warranty replaced everything, because the dealer tried cleaning them and the grease would seep back out of the shoes once they got warm, and back to square one.

So, since then, I've never added grease. I have about 40,000 miles on on it now. Wheels still spin free with no noise. Brakes are worn out however, so looks like a regular old re-pack with new brakes is the way to go.

2000 Ford E450 V10 VAN! 450,000+ miles
2014 ORV really big trailer
2015 Ford Focus ST

Posted By: mike-s on 02/11/18 08:59pm

Anytime the bearings need grease, they also need to be checked for pits and the brake linings need to be checked. There's no practical advantage to EZ-lube for RVs. Boat trailers may be different, but there are Bearing Buddies for those.

Posted By: Slowmover on 02/12/18 08:56pm

I don’t LIKE doing hearing re-packs or brake adjustments, but also don’t figure that more than a year regardless of mileage (might be zero) is a good idea. One year or six thousand is enough.

True, I’m on HADCO axles, not beer-can thin Dexters, and most of the bearings are still the 1989 TiMKEN originals. Prefer not to have to start over. Plus since I’m getting dirty anyway, a good time to slide under this low slung trailer.

Combine the job with the tests of brake electrics. New Breakaway every three years, etc.

Thx for all the earlier info. A classic great RVnet thread!

1990 35' SILVER STREAK Sterling, 9k GVWR
2004 DODGE RAM 2WD 305/555 ISB, QC SRW LB NV-5600, 9k GVWR
Hensley Arrow; 11-cpm solo, 17-cpm towing fuel cost

Posted By: Cummins12V98 on 02/13/18 06:52am

Here is a spec for QUALITY replacement "O" rings for the 8K plastic hub caps. "The O Ring Store" has them. The basic black don't seem to hold up well. Another DRV owner posted it on the Thor DRV Forum.

I ordered mine yesterday they won't ship til about the 20th as they are out of stock.

12 x -230 BV75 Brown FKM (Viton, Fluorocarbon) 75 Duro O-Rings (BV75230)

[image]

Print | Close