Before continuing, there's a lot of conflicting and contradictory information on Dodge starter relays on the 'net so be careful. Some is iffy and some is downright scary or perplexing. Likewise, Google has a problem keeping Dodge, Ford, GMC, and so forth separate and distinct. (For example, googling "1979 Dodge starter relay" will bring up links for Ford starter relays -- it's a search algorithm issue.)
Model year 1973 and earlier used a four terminal relay, apparently without any variations. SMP part number SR-103.
Model year 1977 and later used a five terminal relay, with several minor variations. SMP part number SR-111.
Model years 1974 through 1976 were a transition period, with either of the two possible. Both part numbers possible.
Standard Motor Products (SMP) part numbers are representative, covering most applications in this thread. The two part numbers above are a starting point and you may need to work with your parts counter person to get an exact match to what you need.
Model year 1973 and earlier:
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/pre_1974_relay_1.jpg)
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/pre_1974_relay_2.jpg)
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/pre_1974_relay_wiring.jpg)
Note the 'fusible link' in the second picture. Whenever I encounter one of these, I try to determine the link's ampere rating and replace it with a Maxi fuse or suitable circuit breaker. (In this case, there's valid arguments for and against self-resetting circuit breakers ... it depends on how well you pay attention to what's going on in your vehicle.)
Model year 1977 and later:
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/post_1976_relay_1.jpg)
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/post_1976_relay_2.jpg)
![[image]](http://www.riffgan.com/misc/rv_net_stuff/post_1976_relay_wiring.jpg)
The first and second images (pictures) show one variation in the form of two blade connections on the center terminal. The third image (illustration) shows an acceptable alternate, in the for of a single blade connection on the center terminal.
Double blade connections on a terminal allows more wires to be connected to that terminal. (As a general rule, you should never place more than four wires on a single terminal connection.)
Another variation, not shown here, is a single or double blade connection instead of the threaded stud. Throughout the decades, the threaded stud was used as a 'common junction' for various parts of the engine's circuits. (e.g., battery and alternator circuit source) I believe replacing the threaded stud with blade connectors occurred in later years, with the 'common junction' moved elsewhere. (This is beyond the scope of my experience so I can't say definitely ... I've only seen it in internet pictures and am too lazy to dig deeper.)
VERY IMPORTANT NOTE: Unlike voltage regulators and ICMs, Dodge starter relays do not get their negative/ground connection through the case or mounting screw. Instead, there's a dedicated negative/ground terminal for ground-side switching. In our motorhomes, this is connected to the automatic transmission's Neutral Safety Switch, which only provides a ground connection when the transmission is in park or neutral.
Note: The neutral safety switch on our automatic transmissions often a combined unit with three terminal prongs. One prong is for the starter relay ground and the other two are a supply-side switch for the back-up lights when the transmission is in reverse gear. (Neutral Safety Switch is a throwback to the early 60s when the switch had a single terminal and purpose ... the term has been retained even though the unit now combines two switches with distinctly different purposes.)
Consider the possibility a previous owner or mechanic may have converted your motorhome from one type of starter relay to the other. (Forethought and logic rarely deters people from doing the inexplicable.)
Likewise, I've seen a few cases where someone has replaced the OEM starter relay with a larger Ford-type starter relay. I imagine they had to put a lot of time and effort into that. To do it successfully requires a significant degree of knowledge.
Enough, TTFN.
1970 Explorer Class A on a 1969 Dodge M300 chassis with 318 cu. in. (split year)
1972 Executive Class A on a Dodge M375 chassis with 413 cu. in.
1973 Explorer Class A on a Dodge RM350 (R4) chassis with 318 engine & tranny from 1970 Explorer Class A
My wife and I bought our 1976 Monaco Class C for $500 from the original owner's widow. He kept immaculate care of the rig and made sure to seal the roof every two years....never had a leak. The 360 is currently being rebuilt and upgraded with a beefier cam and 4BBL. The engine shop has a dyno, so the engine will be broken in and dyno'd, so it will be ready to go, when I install it.
The LoadFlite 727 has been rebuilt, as have the driveshafts that were severely out of balance. I got rid of the 16.5" wheels in favor of 16" and 225/75/16 BFGoodrich Commercial All Season TA 2 tires.
The Monaco is currently at an RV furniture shop getting the interior completely redone...new vinyl floor, new carpet, new cushions, new cab-over mattress, day/night pleated shades, valances, and the cab has been reupholstered as well.
I took pics of the progress so far, but they're not that great. It doesn't matter, though, because apparently I'm not able to upload pics here.
Fred
Retired Army Guy
2005 Monaco LaPalma 37PST
Workhorse W24 chassis
8.1L Vortec
Allison 2100 MH
Onyx Color Scheme
StingrayL82 wrote:
Hi Everyone,
I took pics of the progress so far, but they're not that great. It doesn't matter, though, because apparently I'm not able to upload pics here.
Hi Everyone,
I took pics of the progress so far, but they're not that great. It doesn't matter, though, because apparently I'm not able to upload pics here.
Check out the forums help and support .
It is easy to post pictures here if you use the info provided.
2004 Gulf Stream Endura 6340 D/A SOLD
2012 Chevy Captiva Toad SOLD
To post pics, you have to use a free hosting site like postimages.org, then use the IMG tags around the link in your post.
'73 Concord 20' Class A w/Dodge 440 - see profile for photo
StingrayL82 wrote:
Hi Everyone,
My wife and I bought our 1976 Monaco Class C for $500 from the original owner's widow. He kept immaculate care of the rig and made sure to seal the roof every two years....never had a leak. The 360 is currently being rebuilt and upgraded with a beefier cam and 4BBL. The engine shop has a dyno, so the engine will be broken in and dyno'd, so it will be ready to go, when I install it.
The LoadFlite 727 has been rebuilt, as have the driveshafts that were severely out of balance. I got rid of the 16.5" wheels in favor of 16" and 225/75/16 BFGoodrich Commercial All Season TA 2 tires.
The Monaco is currently at an RV furniture shop getting the interior completely redone...new vinyl floor, new carpet, new cushions, new cab-over mattress, day/night pleated shades, valances, and the cab has been reupholstered as well.
I took pics of the progress so far, but they're not that great. It doesn't matter, though, because apparently I'm not able to upload pics here.
Hi Everyone,
My wife and I bought our 1976 Monaco Class C for $500 from the original owner's widow. He kept immaculate care of the rig and made sure to seal the roof every two years....never had a leak. The 360 is currently being rebuilt and upgraded with a beefier cam and 4BBL. The engine shop has a dyno, so the engine will be broken in and dyno'd, so it will be ready to go, when I install it.
The LoadFlite 727 has been rebuilt, as have the driveshafts that were severely out of balance. I got rid of the 16.5" wheels in favor of 16" and 225/75/16 BFGoodrich Commercial All Season TA 2 tires.
The Monaco is currently at an RV furniture shop getting the interior completely redone...new vinyl floor, new carpet, new cushions, new cab-over mattress, day/night pleated shades, valances, and the cab has been reupholstered as well.
I took pics of the progress so far, but they're not that great. It doesn't matter, though, because apparently I'm not able to upload pics here.
WOW! Sounds like it'll be better than new when you're done. The engine shop you're using sound like they know what they're doing.
RE Photos, I've been using a paid subscription from these guys for the last 18 years with no problems what so ever. I think I pay $23.95 per year, and all my photos have safe all these years.
www.fototime.com
They also have a free service so you can try them out, but your photos will get purged every so often.
Downsizing ">
I have been looking everywhere for screens to cover the furnace vents on my 1979 Fleetwood. This last winter mud daubers got into my furnace and built a large nest. Now I have to remove and tear apart my furnace to clean it out.
I have looked everywhere I could find for the stainless steel screens sold for preventing mud daubers from getting in through these vents. But I cannot find any that will fit. Here are my vents:
![[image]](http://i63.tinypic.com/xeeedd.jpg)
The diameter of the back plate is 5 inches.
Anyone have a solution?
Also, does anyone have any hints on removing and replacing the furnace?
You may want to do the same for your refrigerator and water heater. (Ordinary hardware cloth -- window screen material -- works for flat vents, as long as they don't get too hot.)
Your refrigerator usually has an intake vent down low on the outside of the motorhome. In turn, an exhaust vent up high or on the roof. The water heater usually has two vents (high and low) on the exterior access door.
As for removing and replacing the furnace, my experience is a large vocabulary of swear words, in multiple languages, comes in handy.
Difficult parts are disconnecting the propane line and 12VDC blower motor wires. The 120VAC is usually an ordinary three-prong plug in a standard household outlet.
Physical removal and replacement is dependent entirely on how Fleetwood designed and built your particular model. Unfortunately, motorhomes aren't designed and built with maintenance in mine, so you may be in for a tussle.
The furnaces are usually bolted down and invariably there's one bolt you can't see, don't notice, or can't quite reach. So, have someone with small hands and arms available.
Yes, I found all kinds of screens online, but none will fit the old style vents. I was just wondering if someone else had found screens or fixed it some other way.
The thought just occurred to me that perhaps I can replace the vents themselves and then get some screens for them. I will take a look.
I had already thought of window screen, but I fear it would block the air flow to some extent which could cause problems. Also, I note that most of the commercial screens I have seen are bowl shaped which increases the surface area greatly--and they use screen with much larger holes. This probably makes the air flow restriction negligible.
Furnace removal: Ah yes, swearing does release some of the stress. I will keep that in mind!
And thanks for the hidden bolt tip.
I already checked the refer and didn't find any nests. It has a large side vent (about a sq ft) which does need screening. I am going to look for some regular house vent screen (about 1/8" openings), but I didn't find any at either Home Depot or Lowes. Maybe on their website...
Thanks for the suggestions.
We all know how bad our stock converter/chargers are in these old RVs.
I was looking at the newer ones that have multi-stage chargers. I have seen multi-stage chargers go above 15v during charging. And this voltage is distributed to the house wiring. I am concerned about what effect this may have on more modern electronics.
I note that some of the interior light bulb replacements that are LED, handle increased voltage better than others. Some tend to burn out when exposed to higher voltages.
I also wonder about using USB chargers (plugged into the 12v circuit) to charge very expensive phones, tablets, etc.
My converter is 30amps. I am considering putting in a 12v regulator to keep the voltage constant even during battery charging. If I upgrade to a newer converter/charger they all seem to start at 45amps. Ideally, it would be best to regulate the entire 12V DC curcuit, but I haven't yet found one with that kind of current capacity, and if I do I expect it will be several hundred dollars.
Any thoughts? Is 15v+ going to cause problems, or is not something to worry about?
1. Furnace vent screens:
I think it's a brand difference rather than old versus new. My '69/70 M300 Class A had the one piece intake/exhaust 'bezel' versus what your picture showed. Mine could have been a retrofit, possibly with more BTUs for Alaska's weather. (I've encountered a snow shower at sea level on a Memorial Weekend.)
Mine was definitely old, based on what I encountered when I pulled it to renew the wiring and increase wire size on its 12VDC side. (It had a transformer, rectifier, and relay to automatically switch to 120VAC when plugged into shore power.) I don't recall if a fault or wire appearance caused me to rewire it.
2. Power converter and coach (house) voltage.
13.5VDC (plus or minus several tenths of a volt) is 'standard' when the engine alternator is active. Likewise, the North America standard for household voltage encompasses a range. (I don't have the figures at hand but seem to recall 107VAC as the bottom end of the range for being within standards ... similar variance on the top end of the range.)
Most electronics made for motor vehicles have internal regulators for 'smoothing out' input voltage. This is in recognition the voltage from a vehicle battery/alternator system varies by several volts.
Old style (cigarette lighter) power supplies/chargers (for laptops, etc.) had similar regulator/filters. The USB standard tightened up the acceptable range and the standard is firmer. (The USB standard is driven by industry concerns and demands.)
Blue Sea Systems offers (at least) two USB outlets for cell phones, laptops, and so forth. The less expensive one is more generic while the more expensive one has sensor circuits for adjusting output for some (mostly Apple) devices. (IIRC, the USB standard includes 'talk back' capability for intelligent chargers, although not all manufacturers use it.)
If you opt for an additional regulator, you want an electronic regulator/filter made for that purpose. An engine voltage regulator won't work for this purpose. (Engine voltage regulators govern the input voltage to the alternator's field rather than the alternator's output.)
I'd recommend a new power converter and strongly suggest the brand Leeann has. My logic is why spend money to 'fix' possible problems with an old converter ... a new (modern) converter eliminates the possible problems.
I recently took an in-depth look at what Leeann has and really like what I found. Based on what I saw, I've thrown some of my SOP practices out the window. (I tend to be an immovable dinosaur, wary of 'new and improved' technology until it's proven ... so that's significant.)