03Ultra
Central Massachusetts
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Joined: 07/20/2004
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s & s wrote:Mike,
I never intended to say there is NO problem with the brake calipers but in talking with several WORKHORSE chassis owners it's funny that the ones I've talked to, the majority have not had any issue to date and YES I have talked to ones that have had a problem as well. I mentioned that the motorhome I own had an issue with the previous owner but I to date have had NO problem. So just stop and think about it, some of it might just have to do with driving habits. Again some owners I've spoken with who knew of previous problems have had none either. So what opinon would you come up with? I'm not saying there is not a problem at this moment sitting behind any caliper on my motorhome but just the style of driving may be aleviating it from happening. Also as I mentioned before Workhorse is not the problem it's Bosch that's the problem. Sure it may be taking a while but they can't replace what they can't get there hands on.
The problem as it was explained to me by the repair tech at the service center was water in the fluid causes the caliper to stick. The caliper does not stick "hard", meaning that it does not necessarily lock the wheel, only creates a drag that can go unnoticed in stop and go traffic or when towing. The water in the fluid is caused by condensation and there is nothing you can do to make it happen or prevent it, although there is a school of thought that people who drive more often seem to have less problems. It may be that the condensation forms as a result of prolonged inactivity.
I am not claiming to be an expert, but I got this from someone I would consider an expert. I wondered if there was something I could change about the way I was driving and both the WH factory rep (once they finally admitted my rig was included in the recall) and the repair tech both said this was a defect and had nothing to do with operator error.
Also, the WH rep says the Bosch caliper was built to spec, that is why there is not a ready replacement. The calipers are used in delivery vans and other light trucks on WH chassis. Two factors to consider -- delivery vehicles on these chassis are usually lighter than the MH's that sit on them, and delivery vehicles are typically driven daily -- one thing that seems to help alleviate the condensation issue for some reason. Bosch has said they are working on a fix, but they point out (according to the service tech) that they built the calipers to WH specs and they are, indeed, not on anyone else's chassis. I think there is a little bit of friction between Bosch and WH over this issue, but now that WH is talking to me I would say they have not blamed Bosch for the problem, they are only saying that Bosch is working on the fix and WH is as eager as the rest of us to see it over and done with.
2004 Itasca 36M Workhorse
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mike brez
milford ct
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Joined: 09/27/2002
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rgatijnet1 wrote:On this forum, the people that complain about the WH brake problems the most, and seem to consider themselves an expert, are non-owners of the affected chassis. Those that do own them, like me, and have not had any problems at all after 40,000+ miles, have nothing to complain about. We just use the coach and enjoy it.
My BIL works for NASA and is considered to be a expert but then again he has no launch pad or rocket in his back yard 
1994 Pace Arrow 33L,454,P30
2oo4 ground up ridgid chopper 120rwhp
http://community.webshots.com/user/oneHD
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mike brez
milford ct
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03Ultra wrote:s & s wrote:Mike,
I never intended to say there is NO problem with the brake calipers but in talking with several WORKHORSE chassis owners it's funny that the ones I've talked to, the majority have not had any issue to date and YES I have talked to ones that have had a problem as well. I mentioned that the motorhome I own had an issue with the previous owner but I to date have had NO problem. So just stop and think about it, some of it might just have to do with driving habits. Again some owners I've spoken with who knew of previous problems have had none either. So what opinon would you come up with? I'm not saying there is not a problem at this moment sitting behind any caliper on my motorhome but just the style of driving may be aleviating it from happening. Also as I mentioned before Workhorse is not the problem it's Bosch that's the problem. Sure it may be taking a while but they can't replace what they can't get there hands on.
The problem as it was explained to me by the repair tech at the service center was water in the fluid causes the caliper to stick. The caliper does not stick "hard", meaning that it does not necessarily lock the wheel, only creates a drag that can go unnoticed in stop and go traffic or when towing. The water in the fluid is caused by condensation and there is nothing you can do to make it happen or prevent it, although there is a school of thought that people who drive more often seem to have less problems. It may be that the condensation forms as a result of prolonged inactivity.
I am not claiming to be an expert, but I got this from someone I would consider an expert. I wondered if there was something I could change about the way I was driving and both the WH factory rep (once they finally admitted my rig was included in the recall) and the repair tech both said this was a defect and had nothing to do with operator error.
Also, the WH rep says the Bosch caliper was built to spec, that is why there is not a ready replacement. The calipers are used in delivery vans and other light trucks on WH chassis. Two factors to consider -- delivery vehicles on these chassis are usually lighter than the MH's that sit on them, and delivery vehicles are typically driven daily -- one thing that seems to help alleviate the condensation issue for some reason. Bosch has said they are working on a fix, but they point out (according to the service tech) that they built the calipers to WH specs and they are, indeed, not on anyone else's chassis. I think there is a little bit of friction between Bosch and WH over this issue, but now that WH is talking to me I would say they have not blamed Bosch for the problem, they are only saying that Bosch is working on the fix and WH is as eager as the rest of us to see it over and done with.
May want to read here Im no expert or own one but I do read alot. Dont think water in the fluid is the cause.
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427435
Rochester, Mn
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Joined: 11/12/2005
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mike brez wrote:03Ultra wrote:s & s wrote:Mike,
I never intended to say there is NO problem with the brake calipers but in talking with several WORKHORSE chassis owners it's funny that the ones I've talked to, the majority have not had any issue to date and YES I have talked to ones that have had a problem as well. I mentioned that the motorhome I own had an issue with the previous owner but I to date have had NO problem. So just stop and think about it, some of it might just have to do with driving habits. Again some owners I've spoken with who knew of previous problems have had none either. So what opinon would you come up with? I'm not saying there is not a problem at this moment sitting behind any caliper on my motorhome but just the style of driving may be aleviating it from happening. Also as I mentioned before Workhorse is not the problem it's Bosch that's the problem. Sure it may be taking a while but they can't replace what they can't get there hands on.
The problem as it was explained to me by the repair tech at the service center was water in the fluid causes the caliper to stick. The caliper does not stick "hard", meaning that it does not necessarily lock the wheel, only creates a drag that can go unnoticed in stop and go traffic or when towing. The water in the fluid is caused by condensation and there is nothing you can do to make it happen or prevent it, although there is a school of thought that people who drive more often seem to have less problems. It may be that the condensation forms as a result of prolonged inactivity.
I am not claiming to be an expert, but I got this from someone I would consider an expert. I wondered if there was something I could change about the way I was driving and both the WH factory rep (once they finally admitted my rig was included in the recall) and the repair tech both said this was a defect and had nothing to do with operator error.
Also, the WH rep says the Bosch caliper was built to spec, that is why there is not a ready replacement. The calipers are used in delivery vans and other light trucks on WH chassis. Two factors to consider -- delivery vehicles on these chassis are usually lighter than the MH's that sit on them, and delivery vehicles are typically driven daily -- one thing that seems to help alleviate the condensation issue for some reason. Bosch has said they are working on a fix, but they point out (according to the service tech) that they built the calipers to WH specs and they are, indeed, not on anyone else's chassis. I think there is a little bit of friction between Bosch and WH over this issue, but now that WH is talking to me I would say they have not blamed Bosch for the problem, they are only saying that Bosch is working on the fix and WH is as eager as the rest of us to see it over and done with.
May want to read here Im no expert or own one but I do read alot. Dont think water in the fluid is the cause.
As the link above indicates, solving this brake problem is not a technical problem. I think the problem is Workhorse's new owner and Bosch arguing about who's going to pay and for what. It's dragged on way too long for the delay to be anything else.
Mark
2000 Itasca Suncruiser 35U on a Ford chassis, 65,000 miles
2003 Ford Explorer toad with US Gear brakes,
Ready Brute tow bar, and Demco base plate.
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gonzo71
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
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Joined: 10/05/2003
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rgatijnet1 wrote:On this forum, the people that complain about the WH brake problems the most, and seem to consider themselves an expert, are non-owners of the affected chassis. Those that do own them, like me, and have not had any problems at all after 40,000+ miles, have nothing to complain about. We just use the coach and enjoy it.
Me too, absolutely no probelm, 2002 HR with 20,000 miles.
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2002 Holiday Rambler Vacationer 34SBD, W22 Workhorse, 8.1L Vortec
2007 Suzuki Grand Vitara JLX-L (lil toad)
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xctraveler
Rochester, NY for a starting point
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Joined: 10/28/2002
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Just to add another "no brake problem yet" voice to the chatter. The coach in the signature has over 65k miles and I just replaced the rear brake pads for wear. There is no rotor issue and no sign of overheat on any of the rotors. Have done plenty of stop and go in traffic and long grades. We do keep on the move, with the longest storage less than 3 months in the Rochester area - not the highest humidity area, if that makes a difference. There is no sign of water in the brake fluid.
I pay close attention to the brakes and hope we get the recall work done soon. But not letting it slow us down.
Paul
Trucking down the road in a 2004 Southwind 36E on Workhorse Chassis with a 2005 Toyota RAV4 4WD stick shift tow'd with US Gear Unified Tow Brake System. Check out my blog
FMCA 352081 SKP# 99526
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jakcheese
Alhambra, CA, USA
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Joined: 07/27/2004
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2cyber71 wrote:I got in a lot of heated discussions here on the Forum on the subject of Workhorse vs Ford....I'm refraining from this one and just watching....most old forum members know my opinion already.  DITTO! Been there, done that!
Jackcheese and Motlah
2006 Dolphin LX 6320 W22 Workhorse chassis
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jakcheese
Alhambra, CA, USA
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rgatijnet1 wrote:On this forum, the people that complain about the WH brake problems the most, and seem to consider themselves an expert, are non-owners of the affected chassis. Those that do own them, like me, and have not had any problems at all after 40,000+ miles, have nothing to complain about. We just use the coach and enjoy it.
DITTO! 37,000 miles of joy!
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bsinmich
Holland, MI
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Joined: 11/18/2000
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Last year I had the brake problem 3 times and cut my vacation short. This year I flushed the brake fluid again (I do this every year) and went on vacation for a trip around Lake Michigan and Western Wisconsin, with no brake problem. I am going again in 2 weeks for another 1500 mile trip and hoping for the same. The biggest problem is never knowing if the problem will show up again. When I called Workhorse last summer the official word was to "just pull over and let it cool for an hour, then continue". This just doesn't give confidence. Three years of this problem hasnging over our heads is way too long. Those of us who have had the problem are convinced Workhorse doesn't care about their customers.
2003 Newmar Mountain Aire, Workhorse W22, 2008 Saturn Vue, Falcon 5250, & US Gear Unified Tow Brake
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gbs2320
USA
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Joined: 02/22/2006
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Only the chassis w. bosch brakes are at issue. The workhorse UFO gas pusher and W24 chassises have meritor brakes and are not problematic. In fact the meritor quadralic (4 piston caliper) brakes in tests have been shown to provide very short stopping distances.
2008, Winnabego Destination UFO Gas Pusher, 8.1 GM, Allison 6spd
Dinghy: 2009 Honda Fit
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